@MasterDarkwingz said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

@Miraglyth said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

@MasterDarkwingz said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

All I do know is that SEGA gave them the code for pretty much everything in the game.

Ah good, we're back to this. This is useful, it allows me to ask you instead: How do you know this?

Because how else would they be capable of giving Hitsugi and Al clothes in Ep 4?

The obvious follow up question is identical to the last one.

And to respond to subsequent posts: It's not gaslighting to ask for you to explain why you believe something.

@Nope21 said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

@Laep localizer are not just a translator and this is where you're mistaken, it's only one of their job. Their job also include porting game to different platform as well as making patches if necessary, now if they don't have the source code how else would they be able to do that? Black magic?

For your benefit, Laep covered this off a few pages ago:

@Laep said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

we know Sega of Japan has final say on everything. LionBridge is literally just a contractor. They're given audio and spreadsheets of text to translate, they do it, add their little localizations and localization notes, and send it back. That's probably the extent of it.

This speaks of what's probable. Honestly I don't think anyone has provided any sources to confirm whether Lionbridge get source code access or just a text / audio export that they translate and send back to be used as the EN language files. Or something in between. If I had to guess I would guess that it's something closer to the latter just on the basis of what's practical and cost-effective.

But I'm not going to guess because the point of this is to show that multiple possibilities exist. Hence any profession that one of the possibilities is surely correct without anything backing that up looks highly presumptive. And any proposed action based off a potentially incorrect belief is not wise.

@MasterDarkwingz said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

All I do know is that SEGA gave them the code for pretty much everything in the game.

Ah good, we're back to this. This is useful, it allows me to ask you instead: How do you know this?

@MasterDarkwingz said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

we just want this fixed quickly, and blaming LionBridge for doing censorship since the start of NA and through Global is really all we could do to grab a GM's attention enough

You're using blame as a kind of moderation clickbait? That's... new. And curious. Personally I don't believe that is needed (and obviously I think it risks doing more harm than good to any request). I also wonder if that's a shared viewpoint.

@MasterDarkwingz said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

@Miraglyth said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

We can complain about such removals without needing to guess who was responsible for them and potentially miss the mark. "We would like the omitted comics to be restored!" is a more sensible request than "Party X should be fired because I reckon they censored the comics (but I won't even say why I think that), in other words they suck!"

It's more of a mix of counter culture against outrage culture which actively censors content-

Henceforth the all we can do is blame LionBridge game.

I'm sorry... but I'm not following here. What? Why couldn't players directly ask for something that was omitted to be included? I don't see how perceptions of culture require blame to be given, and if that blame happens to be misdirected the request would probably be ignored automatically so that seems like a bad idea all around.

@Krinos said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

**And if so, are you saying they kept Sega in the dark about that?

For the final time yes.

Nice selective editing of the quote. Let me add the context back in to show how nonsensical this is:

@Miraglyth said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

The removal of story scenes they presumably translated in the first place. The removal of Smart Inner and probably other clothing visuals. The limitation of the character height slider. Are you saying Lionbridge did that? And if so, are you saying they kept Sega in the dark about that?

This is not the final time - it's the first time. If you'd just answered in the first place instead of vague statements like "Lionbridge does localization" without detailing what that meant, this wouldn't have dragged out as it plainly did.

So! Now we have you confirming at last your belief that Lionbridge are calling all the shots. That they removed content like Smart Inner and changed height sliders without Sega's knowledge or consent because the Sega-employed development team we know to be working on PSO2 Global apparently don't do the development for PSO2 Global or even vet the development you are claiming a third party is injecting.

On this point, I fully agree with @Laep and their subsequent explanation: You've provided no supporting evidence to explain why you believe the localisation partner have this much power and capability. The accusation is coming across as completely blind and rash, and appears to be based entirely off your emotive dislike for the manner of their conduct as a business and as an employer which until shown otherwise is completely unrelated.

So provide that evidence or stop trying to conflate things you can't. Or, you know, keep pretending the way they treat their workers gives them the ability to change game code. I can't stop you making yourself look daft.

@Krinos said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

Second: Also Mr. and/or Mrs wanna-be mod

Brief reminder, my last post explicitly said I wasn't a mod. I've tried to help you learn how to make a coherent and compelling complaint. I see I've failed there, but I don't blame myself for that.

@MasterDarkwingz said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

@Krinos said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

Third of all, you have not added or contributed to anything in this post.

^ This, 100% this [snip] we don't have to back up our opinions or show things we search on mobile and can't find on PC due to the Google search overlord.

This is a mixture of two points, really. Conceptually you are correct that anyone here can post whatever opinion they want to so long as that opinion doesn't break other forum rules. This is the same as any other private forum. Whether or not that opinion is one shared by others or even makes any sense doesn't matter at all.

It's my understanding however that this topic was posted with the intention of causing change in the makeup of companies involved with bringing us PSO2 Global. The topic title for instance is essentially a demand, I hope you find that agreeable? As such, the opinions within are implied to be written with the intent to substantiate that demand - to explain why the community support team should take the demand seriously and to provide them with both a reason and compelling motivation to follow it up.

As I said before, if there is a genuine act of incompetence or malice by one of the partners involved in providing Global, I firmly believe that should be (a) adequately detailed so it can be (b) escalated and (c) addressed. The problem with this topic is it fails at part (a) of that last sentence. We've essentially seen a presentation that paraphrases to "A localisation partner must be responsible for secretly changing code to censor the game and also translating streams and media they may not be responsible for, because here are some Glassdoor reviews!"

That doesn't make sense. It just doesn't. If there's a real complaint with actual (relevant) evidence, it would be tragic for the players and the game if the failure to properly detail it means the complaint isn't taken seriously. My contribution to this topic from my first post has been to try and determine if this is the case (and if so, the continued and now stubborn absence of such evidence isn't on me) or if it's not (in which case the question then becomes whether the topic is misguided or malicious).

@Krinos said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

Maybe they'll even make Miraglyth a mod, and everyone's dreams will come true.

Pass. I don't believe this forum has volunteer mods in the first place, but even if it did I want to advocate for the game's betterment from the position and perspective of someone who is a player and nothing else. Not that this has anything to do with the topic either, making me wonder why you bring it up.

@Milk said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

Because I didn’t and I find it abhorrent that a company would disrespect the artist’s work, no matter whose fault this is.

Honestly, this is an excellent summary of a lot of what I've said above. We can complain about such removals without needing to guess who was responsible for them and potentially miss the mark. "We would like the omitted comics to be restored!" is a more sensible request than "Party X should be fired because I reckon they censored the comics (but I won't even say why I think that), in other words they suck!"

@Milk said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

Did you guys personally have a problem with the two cut comics so far

I've only seen one of them since it was linked early in the topic that first mentioned it. For me if it was removed for the reason people think it was, it was a little over-cautious yeah.

@coldreactive said in LQ is unavailable for new characters?:

Some also require the Za'udan Suppression ARKS Quest.

Definitely not this one; the character in question is my rare container farmer.

@Krinos I'd like to draw your attention to something here, that I hope you will treat as a learning experience: Please pay attention to Laep's posts when they first entered the topic a few pages ago, as they contain two distinct elements you should be able to separate and recognise.

Element 1

Reasonably questioning your logic and adding sensibility to what thusfar have come across as rash and vague accusations:

@Laep said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

We have no idea who the live translators were, they may not have even been lionbridge and in fact the company they're from doesn't matter.

@Laep said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

Your assumptions about the internal thoughts of SEGA and their relationship with LionBridge are not useful, they're also probably not even remotely correct.

@Laep said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

its illogical to come up with complicated solutions about how "Oh poor Sega!! LionBridge is scamming them and cutting so much out of the game and they don't even know it!"

Element 2

Being offensive, divisive and overstepping to claim that changes made should never be questioned:

@Laep said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

We don't need official statements from SEGA, nothing of consequence has been cut

@Laep said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

the only negative impact it had was bringing the victimized coomers out in droves to plague the forum

@Laep said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

You people need to stop pretending

I hope you can identify the cause and effect here: By making irresponsibly vague accusations and not not answering reasonable challenges about what you are saying was changed, how, and why you came to believe that they were made without Sega's knowledge or consent, you have empowered argumentative people to conflate sensibility with agenda.

You have provided both encouragement and ammunition to jump into the topic, to start fighting and to make over-reaching statements about whether content alterations are acceptable that are not only a pretty obvious shot at getting the topic locked but have also led to others introducing laughable new terms like "appropriate censorship" for extended derailing of your intention with this topic.

It's my hope that you can appreciate this cause and effect relationship and either attempt to rebase and rationalise your complaints about the localisation partner here or - failing that - consider your approach to future such complaints.

Of course, I'm not a moderator or affiliated with any party running this game so you don't have to listen to me. It's just a plea to reason, to introduce complaints about company policies and practise with more credible detail such that inaccuracies or unsubstantiated links can't be used both to damage your own intention and the hopes of improvement for potentially unrelated matters.

All that said, the conversation has rather miraculously stabilised in the last few pages to the point that I even want to apologise to @Laep for calling out some of the early posts' tone and civility as more recent posts have in much more amenable wording to discuss the possibilities of both content adjustments (to the level of flavour text - by the way I'm in agreement with everyone here that NGS including those really would be nice!) and companies' treatment of their workers.

This is probably largely also to do with these being treated as separate matters.

@AndrlCh said in LQ is unavailable for new characters?:

To unlock Limited Quests on a character, you must run Forest Expedition at least once on said character.

Thanks! That explains why my oldest alt didn't have it listed. I was confused! Amusingly it's done pretty much every exploration except Forest. What an amusing omission.

Technique using classes can double-jump from the cliff they'll be standing over after clearing either side and Ilzonde across to the top of the cliff on the other side. That helps.

If a whole party of four leaves, it could be that the party leader did something nasty like disbanding the party and forcefully eject the other three.

@Krinos said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

@Miraglyth said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

So for the third time - Are you saying the outsourced localisation partner translated a story cutscene and then somehow got it removed from the story quest list without Sega finding out about it?

Or are you just saying the outsourced localisation partner is making changes to various pieces of text which are by and far a minority of the censorship complaint?

Which one is it? Let's start from there.

I'm quite frankly not sure what more you want from me. I've laid what I've said out as basic as I could so it could be understood. I AM ACCUSING Lionbridge of censoring the game via removal of content in terms of censorship

My goodness. I don't think it's possible to answer the question in a more simple way and you're still failing to answer it. Or perhaps are you just refusing?

The removal of story scenes they presumably translated in the first place. The removal of Smart Inner and probably other clothing visuals. The limitation of the character height slider. Are you saying Lionbridge did that?

And if so, are you saying they kept Sega in the dark about that?

And not, are you saying the scope of their alleged censorship is only text?

Three questions with yes or no answers. There's no plausible way for you to not get this.

And stop hiding behind vague language like "It's all very basic, they localize, they censor". Sega obviously still have a development role in PSO2 Global; they've been mentioned by Global producer Yuji Nakazawa. They didn't just pawn off the entire JP version source code to a third party and let them do whatever they wanted without any oversight, and Global-only content like the Steam promotion wasn't modelled by a localisation company. That you're continually implying otherwise is remarkably silly.

@Krinos said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

So far as you've mentioned very clearly is that they removed Cutscenes, sure

Flaming heck... no, I have not mentioned this at all, let alone "very clearly". This whole time I have been asking if that is what you are accusing them of. How are you not getting this?

@Krinos said in Lionbridge Studio needs to stop localizing PSO2:

Outfits & items that are of lewd nature are removed from the game entirely. The height scaling in the character creation menu was altered of course as many have noticed.

What you are doing here is providing two probably unrelated statements:

• "This is the translation company"
• "Content was altered in localisation"

And repeatedly implied that the company did the alterations. You haven't explicitly said it, and I am asking if this is what you mean. It's simple: You have two choices for what to say here. Option 1: "I believe the localisation company removed cutscenes and kept Sega in the dark about it". Option 2: "I don't believe the localisation company removed the cutscenes, that one was probably another of the partners." Repeat the same choices for the other changes that cause most of the complaints.

Option 1 would mean you either have some basis for this belief that it would serve everyone well to be provided, or you've jumped to conclusions and everyone would benefit from that misinformation being ceased. Option 2 would mean the reach of the censorship you are accusing them of is much less than people have taken to believing thanks to this topic, and it would benefit them to know better as well. It would also mean you weren't being honest about saying they kept Sega in the dark about everything early in this topic.