WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?

@Kyo-Senpai

I already admitted to be fairly ignorant. So a restatement of such doesn't make me feel like I want to even accept an open dialogue with you. But I will anyway.

Firstly as I've made it more than clear now in other responses I don't care about optimal. I don't care about meta. I don't care about min maxing. Etc.

The only thing I care about is being able to play what I want to play in content I care about. That being said I'm perfectly aware some classes are better than others. I do not deny that scions are obviously better than base classes.

I'm just not comfortable with people thinking they have to play a specific class in order to accomplish what they want to do in the game. Hence again why I said my goal when posting here has never been to muddy or disprove scion class capability or power.

But to remind others who might peak in that you don't need to play a scion class to complete content. Perhaps to you and other vets this is "no duh" information.

But you guys probably forget how unforgiving this game is when it comes to accessibility. Beyond asking a vet or looking up community sourced and approved content it's difficult to find information about the game.

As far as why I ignore endless as a measurement from a personal standpoint it feels far too much like a game I used to play called Warframe. In where people fell into the trap of deeming things worthy of time or not based on how well things could kill other things in situations that for one reason or another were not realistic norms in pretty much any kind of meaningful content.

Beyond that though my only experience with how the community looks at endless comes from this very sight. Which has both jp and na players alike. I can and will take responsibility if I read the room wrong (so to speak) and was given misinformation based off of a thread stating that endless doesn't dictate class balance/effectiveness.

If it's truly the norm in JP then so be it.

@Bellion

To keep this brief since I've grown tired of repeating myself I'll say two things.

First, please define what "demanding content" is for me. Thank you for your time and telling me the additional info at the bottom of your response.

And second I feel like using endless as a sole point for talking about general game balance is a bit much specifically because the situations you find yourself in said quests are not in "normal" content. Like it's next to impossible to dodge through all attacks in endless with say hero. But in pretty much any other content you can. Would you say that makes heros loop of "not getting hit" flawed?

This isn't to say that there's no useful information to be gleamed from using endless. I just don't think it should be the entire thing someone hinges their argument on when talking about balance (not to accuse you of doing so.)

Regardless. Thanks again for responding. As any information about the game I care to know about

Still wildly off topic so to get back on topic. I am seriously looking forward to trying all the Scion classes but am most psyched about Phantom. I wouldn't know if it was stronger than the other classes but super fast casting time, invincibility while charging, and the marker system make it seem really appealing to me more so than the others.

Back on topic, the answer is Luster. If I had to compare the classes the base classes would be like driving a stick shift car while Hero, Phantom, and Etoile would be like driving an automatic car and Luster is the self driving car of the future. Sure a manual stick shift can go faster than an automatic in certain circumstances but the automatic is just so much easier to drive why bother to learn how to use to a stick shift. And a self driving car is pretty explanatory about ease of use.

@Vexation yes I apologize for dragging the thread off topic. I felt compelled to respond to the 4 that responded to me.

I shall minimize responses to that discussion should any more come in the future.

OT I'm only fimiliar enough with HR and PH so I can't really say what is the strongest. Based on what little I've seen of etiole and luster I'd have to say luster seems to be the easy clear Victor over the rest.

But it's design is so wildly different like Hero's that I find it to be a bit difficult to call it a fair comparison.

I guess if I had to rank them in order it would be: Luster>Ph/Et (depending on if you play caster only ph or not), and hero.

@NotWhoUThink said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

Back on topic, the answer is Luster. If I had to compare the classes the base classes would be like driving a stick shift car while Hero, Phantom, and Etoile would be like driving an automatic car and Luster is the self driving car of the future. Sure a manual stick shift can go faster than an automatic in certain circumstances but the automatic is just so much easier to drive why bother to learn how to use to a stick shift. And a self driving car is pretty explanatory about ease of use.

Luster is the one I'm second most excited about. At fist I didn't look twice at a gunblade. Then it started to kinda grow on me. Though when I researched what class types would work best for it... I was very disappointed until I read up on Luster. Not sure how it'll play yet, but super excited to try it. Shame Luster is the last we'll get though, but then I guess we'll have NGS to look forward to after that.

If you guys basically want Princess Peach’s parasol as a gunblade camo then I highly suggest nabbing it before Luster comes out. Cute gunblade camos are so cheap right now.

I’ll have Phantom for an alt but it’s not floaty and sparkly enough, everything needs to be Magical Girl levels of brilliance!

@Vexation said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@NotWhoUThink said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

Back on topic, the answer is Luster. If I had to compare the classes the base classes would be like driving a stick shift car while Hero, Phantom, and Etoile would be like driving an automatic car and Luster is the self driving car of the future. Sure a manual stick shift can go faster than an automatic in certain circumstances but the automatic is just so much easier to drive why bother to learn how to use to a stick shift. And a self driving car is pretty explanatory about ease of use.

Luster is the one I'm second most excited about. At fist I didn't look twice at a gunblade. Then it started to kinda grow on me. Though when I researched what class types would work best for it... I was very disappointed until I read up on Luster. Not sure how it'll play yet, but super excited to try it. Shame Luster is the last we'll get though, but then I guess we'll have NGS to look forward to after that.

Luster being the last class really is a shame because only 10 out of the 18 got the love they needed with some of the weapons already being popular choices like katanas and swords while things like wired lances and partizans got left in the dust.

@NotWhoUThink said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

Luster being the last class really is a shame because only 10 out of the 18 got the love they needed with some of the weapons already being popular choices like katanas and swords while things like wired lances and partizans got left in the dust.

It’s sad because those weapons are really fun. When I was leveling my Hunter subclass I had a lot of fun with partizan and it has one of the best camos in the game imho, Marie’s weapon from Zig is godly! Wired Lance was the first weapon I ever played but I gave it up after not being able to keep up with people.

@Milk said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@NotWhoUThink said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

Luster being the last class really is a shame because only 10 out of the 18 got the love they needed with some of the weapons already being popular choices like katanas and swords while things like wired lances and partizans got left in the dust.

It’s sad because those weapons are really fun. When I was leveling my Hunter subclass I had a lot of fun with partizan and it has one of the best camos in the game imho, Marie’s weapon from Zig is godly! Wired Lance was the first weapon I ever played but I gave it up after not being able to keep up with people.

I have a character that uses partizans for cosplay reasons and the biggest issues I find with partizans in general is the lack of good mobility (especially while in combat) and the back loaded damage which makes it difficult to land a good amount of dps on certain targets that are near constantly moving.

@NotWhoUThink said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@Milk said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@NotWhoUThink said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

Luster being the last class really is a shame because only 10 out of the 18 got the love they needed with some of the weapons already being popular choices like katanas and swords while things like wired lances and partizans got left in the dust.

It’s sad because those weapons are really fun. When I was leveling my Hunter subclass I had a lot of fun with partizan and it has one of the best camos in the game imho, Marie’s weapon from Zig is godly! Wired Lance was the first weapon I ever played but I gave it up after not being able to keep up with people.

I have a character that uses partizans for cosplay reasons and the biggest issues I find with partizans in general is the lack of good mobility (especially while in combat) and the back loaded damage which makes it difficult to land a good amount of dps on certain targets that are near constantly moving.

My biggest problem is my main weapon benefits from being in the air and partizan is the opposite, it trips me up every time! I combatted mobility with Safoie Zero since my goodness it’s hard to get around without it! But it’s only my sub class so I don’t know how useful that really is for Hunter mains.

@Milk said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@NotWhoUThink said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@Milk said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@NotWhoUThink said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

Luster being the last class really is a shame because only 10 out of the 18 got the love they needed with some of the weapons already being popular choices like katanas and swords while things like wired lances and partizans got left in the dust.

It’s sad because those weapons are really fun. When I was leveling my Hunter subclass I had a lot of fun with partizan and it has one of the best camos in the game imho, Marie’s weapon from Zig is godly! Wired Lance was the first weapon I ever played but I gave it up after not being able to keep up with people.

I have a character that uses partizans for cosplay reasons and the biggest issues I find with partizans in general is the lack of good mobility (especially while in combat) and the back loaded damage which makes it difficult to land a good amount of dps on certain targets that are near constantly moving.

My biggest problem is my main weapon benefits from being in the air and partizan is the opposite, it trips me up every time! I combatted mobility with Safoie Zero since my goodness it’s hard to get around without it! But it’s only my sub class so I don’t know how useful that really is for Hunter mains.

I don't mind the weakness of partizans being weaker in the air since I use Jild Girola which helps to partly mitigate the weakness of it's air combat capabilities, and as far as movement goes I just use a wired lance since out of combat it has pretty good mobility with it's low pp cost.

If every thread ended when the question was answered then no thread would exceed 1 page. Even if it was an opinion/open ended question in the title, the answer is demonstrably luster.

@Knight-Raime said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@Bellion

To keep this brief since I've grown tired of repeating myself I'll say two things.

First, please define what "demanding content" is for me. Thank you for your time and telling me the additional info at the bottom of your response.

And second I feel like using endless as a sole point for talking about general game balance is a bit much specifically because the situations you find yourself in said quests are not in "normal" content. Like it's next to impossible to dodge through all attacks in endless with say hero. But in pretty much any other content you can. Would you say that makes heros loop of "not getting hit" flawed?

This isn't to say that there's no useful information to be gleamed from using endless. I just don't think it should be the entire thing someone hinges their argument on when talking about balance (not to accuse you of doing so.)

Regardless. Thanks again for responding. As any information about the game I care to know about

I would consider demanding content to be something that has time constraints and puts pressure on you to learn your class to a high extent in order to get far. That would include soloing Urgent Quests whether it is to be able to S-rank it or being able to even achieve a clear by yourself, certain limited time quests, divide quests, endless quests, some of the ultimate quests, etc.

While it's true that there are somethings you do in endless that you will not do elsewhere, it's one of the few places where every single aspect of a class is tested and definitely does emphasize on class strengths and weaknesses. That's why quite a bit of players use that as a sort of benchmark for classes, but at the same time it's correct you shouldn't base the overall class balance on this alone. Different types of content demands different strengths, so we must take that in consideration for which scion classes still dominate overall(especially Luster) but some of the legacy classes do have their niche. Losing Hero Boost in endless is a weakness of the class compared to other scions that doesn't have to worry about getting hit and losing any damage boost. However, it has received updates that allow it to regain damage % back from a successful step counter attack to mitigate that weakness. The amount of attacks that are tossed at you as a Hero are a plus if you can manage between the chaos because it excels at counter damage which essentially means anything that even attacks you is a potential gain in power for you.

Now look at it from a legacy class perspective as Fighter where if you lose your Overload because Overload Safeguard triggered from a sneeze(in a similar situation like Hero losing Hero Boost), you're losing approximately 22-25% damage(ranges based on equipment and skilltree), your double pp recovery from Crazy Heart(quite a big deal to lose), AND you get a longer skill cooldown time. Keep in mind Fighter is currently balanced to only keep up if you have Overload on and anytime it's down it's rather lackluster in damage output. There is no way to mitigate Overload Safeguard, but Hero Boosts's demerit can be mitigated through using the strength of the class. Now if we're adding in safety nets such as Iron Will from Hunter sub that is only a 75% chance and if you've done augmenting in this game you know how often that can fail, and that is out of your control. You have Etoile sub with that hefty damage reduction, but it doesn't stop something like static damage acid rain ticks in Divide Quest or in a certain Limited-time quest, and now you've compromised DS damage if you are a DS player(most Fi players seem to be a DS player or use DS at some point). Essentially all of the higher skilled Fighters have major gripes with this class because it has too many flaws and not enough of a reward for a class meant to be "high risk and high reward" so in reality it's currently "high risk and low reward".

Now, since a majority of players pretty much play scion classes at this point and have stopped playing legacy classes or haven't played them extensively keep commenting on how "classes are balanced, just get better" this sends a message to the developers that things are okay when in reality that's not true. The minority of players that play legacy classes with their voice are drowned by the majority. I believe enough noise was recently made to make the balance team notice that Fighter is indeed in need of balance changes because of a buff to an already good solution PA for Hunter gets something, while Fighter's solution PA got nothing and it's overall inferior in just about every aspect. Just about every Fighter I saw got quite peeved at this to say the least due to constant ignoring of the class problems by the balance team.

Just to be on topic: Luster can also be considered a finalized way to play Etoile DS since they share just about the same mechanics except GS has more things added, faster paced, and definitely stronger. Opinion: Luster is also much more fun to play than Etoile DS.

@coldreactive said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@Zarozion said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

@The-Raven said in WHICH SCION CLASS DO YOU THINK IS THE STRONGEST? HERO? PHANTOM? ETOILE? LUSTER?:

The correct answer is Luster which is currently the strongest class in like 90% of content in the game.

Explain further. = w=

Luster has an ability that basically extends the shoot/gun system where depending on the element of the weapon used, you become a tank, DPS, etc. In addition, your skills completely can change.

Yeah but doesn’t that also depend on the element of your weapon?