Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November)

@SeriPSO2 said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

I'm using JP terminology, because the abbreviations and terminology makes more sense, so when I said, UQ, I meant Ultimate Quest obviously. As mentioned already, the scaling people experience in EF (Enchanted Forest) is the standard scaling across all XH contents where each release towards the end of that episode will only have higher scaling to not have the powercreep from end game builds overpower it. And it would be false to try and correlate XH EF to what Ultimate Quests are when the difficulty between the two are widely different. Ult Nab/Lili/Amd is between that of SH/XH, mobs aren't a sponge nor are the bosses, but you deal with their own unique mechanics/effects/enemies.

So let's get a few things straight for now - you're on the Global Forums. Using Japanese terms for content that's now been localized and released in Global is just going to confuse people that haven't played the Japanese client, or don't WANT To play the Japanese Client. Great, you're a JP player, more power to you. You're posting on the global forums - PLEASE use the global terminology. UQ stands for Urgent Quests, Ultimates are just simply called Ultimates, it's called the Bewitched Woods, not the Enchanted Forest, Extremely Hard is generally abbrdviated as EX, etc.

@SeriPSO2 said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

Also, what you're proposing doesn't make sense when it's the standard scaling for XH and it is a FF to start off, not a UQ. Even to try and compare a XH content to a UQ when the category and difficulty between the two are have their differences. So players entering XH difficulty should know what to expect if they have already done other XH contents, if not, then they should expect it to have a higher level of difficulty than the previous.

I suggested Extremely Hard be re-translated as Ultimate because that's LITERALLY what it is. Bewitched Woods on EX is essentially no different mechanically from what Ultimate Nevarius, Amduskia, and Lilipa were - a single map designed to spawn large amounts of bosses and trash for the sole purpose of farming them endlessly for drops. There is nothing different between how Bewitched Woods on EX works, than how the Ultimate Quests do. This is even more confusing for new players since EX Tokyo and Vegas are barely any more difficult than their Super Hard counterparts, and can easily be done solo.

Having a colloquial term to designate maps that are designed to be done in groups, rather than Solo, would alleviate problems like what we saw in the original topic.

@SeriPSO2 said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

So in what way am I GROSSLY exaggeration when there were none from the start? I'm confused as to your comment because it literally is "Hey, I went in and was semi-afk and everything was okay!", doesn't prove anything. Have you gone in there by yourself to farm? Have you contrast how big of a jump it was from SH vs XH? You were in there with people, which aligns with what I said, where it is a XH's scaling really does turn it into MPA content. And it is a wake-up call because you can obvious tell the gap in difficulty from regular SH content vs that of XH contents, it takes more than facerolling and require people to pay attention.

You're exaggerating in it's difficulty because that's literally what you're doing. Bewitched Woods isn't some kind of epic raid content that requires you to go in with BiS gear, move with a group and coordinate with mechanically difficult bosses that require coordination. It's, as I said before, literally an Ultimatae Quest where you farm, and isn't designed to be done solo, which was my point. I went in with a group, we farmed, I was in no point in any danger of dying due to how easy the bosses are, and was able to BS with some friends on Discord while mindlessly murdering things for drops.

That's not challenging. Saying you need to go in with multiple people does not make it challenging. It just means that it's content designed with multiplayer in mind. That's like saying that a 5-man in WoW or (even more laughably) 4-man content in XIV is difficult because it's not designed to be soloed. No one is going to say that, and saying Bewitched Woods requires a group to efficiently farm in it does not make it a "Wake up call" or make it difficult, no more so than the Ultimate quests did in Episode 3.

And lastly, yes, I did go in when it launched on EX and tried to solo it, and quickly realized due to the enemies inflated health pools that it functioned like an Ultimate, and that it would be laughably inefficient to try to continue to solo farm. To further this point, I also soloed the final boss in Bewtiched Woods on EX. If this was truly the difficult wake up call you said it was, than this shouldn't have been possible, right? Or at the very least no in the timely manner of a few minutes as I did it in. Again - the same as Ultimate quests. I almost always finished my runs in Ultimate with killing the expedition boss once my group left, mostly because I found the fight to be extremely fun.

@SeriPSO2 said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

Also, Omega bosses spawn are considered new as they are EP 5 bosses. It is just they are an upgrade from their oracle form when it comes to certain aspects such as attacks and may have different ele weakness.

The only truly new boss from the Episode 5 story is Apprentice. Elder, Luther, and Gemini's Omega forms are almost identical to their original counterparts, just with one additional enrage phase on each, and compared to Anga Phandage (with the possible exception of Apprentice), they're complete push overs.

@SeriPSO2 said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

I'm not sure what exactly you're arguing or your point is here. If you're doing fine in XH EF then good job, though if you feel like labeling yourself to be one of those newbies/undergeared/inexperienced/lazy players that are carried by gears/people then by all means. Since the entire thread wasn't even about players who know what they're doing and are geared appropriate for the content in the first place.

My point was that for players that are literally able to do only the most basic of content, don't bother to learn enemy attack patterns, builds, or use anything other than the crappy 12* weapons they get from UQ, then yes, Bewitched Wood on EX is going to be extremely difficult, and they're going to find most of their time in it on the floor. But for literally ANYONE who has actually played the game in some capacity at end game and actually tried to learn, Bewitched Woods EX is essentially no different than an Ultimate quest in terms of difficulty and expectation, which is why I called you out on somehow saying they're "Wake up calls".

They're not. Just like how Deus Esca wasn't, nor was the Crimson Fellwyrm, nor will be the Luther and Apprentice refights. At the end of the day, PSO2 is not a difficult game. It requires a bit more from the player than, say, FFXIV, but it's still an extremely casual game. Most people in Global that are playing it aren't going to run into the problems you're talking about, that's simply the way of it.

This game is too casual for this lol

@Blade-Syphon Just piping on the bit about Renaming Extremely hard to Ultimate. I'm going to dip a bit in JP terminology though, so bear with me.

I doubt that's possible. First off, the difficulties on JP are named in katakana and actually abbreviated in some places IN-GAME (SH, VH, XH), I'll come back to that. That mean that Extremely hard isn't called the japanese equivalent that translate into Extremely Hard. It's straight up Extremely Hard. And that's one of the things SEGA doesn't touch, barring translation team mistakes.

Anyway and more importantly, relating to the abbreviated terms, which is arguably the biggest reason. The names and thus abbreviations have stuck se we can say it's not a mistake. Anyway, EP6 brings another difficulty level, Ultra Hard, which is abbreviated to UH. Again, that's the actual names. Changing Extremely hard to Ultimate would break the chain (we'd have SH,VH, UH, UH.).

I'm not opposed to some localization mind you, but terms that are already in katakana for english words don't need to be.

tldr; difficulty names are not localized but the originals as intended, and renaming would clash with the upcoming Ultra Hard (UH).

For reference:

XH(エクストラハード)

UH(ウルトラハード)

Also eager to see people who have never played Ultra Hard before react to the new weakpoint system.

@coldreactive

Sounds great, and I'm casul skum. I love a challenge in my game in the high end diffidulties, so long as it's a fair challenge. Meaning, I work at getting good and not just getting BiS to easily brute force it.

@HarmlessSyan said in [Please be Considerate to Casual Players]

But oh how I wish there was something like expert matching so 24 man raids take only 20mins instead of dragging on for over 40mins sometimes because people keep dying and have little clue on how to dps on their job. And when you try to help them, you get your typical "you don't pay my sub" reply.

You and me both. People even now die from Doom in WoD all the time, it was bad then and it’s still bad. NieR raid was also a nightmare, I just wanted the outfit and every single run half the party would be dead at any given time, I literally cried tears of joy when I didn’t have to do it anymore. The fight could be really fun with a different group.

I have the Mentor crown(like damn near everybody) and try to be helpful in a really friendly way and I still get the “you don’t pay my sub” replies. They don’t want help, accepting help makes them look bad and feel embarrassed, so they react with hostility. I hate healing people who don’t want to get better.

No problem.

If someone has bots out, I leave. If someone dies too much, I ignore them. If someone has autochat out, I blacklist and report for spamming.

@Yggranya

EP5 some what and EP6 kind of push towards the games true calling of being an action game. Having better gear means fights will be shorter for sure. But numbers are so inflated now that it's more about how good you can actually play. This was technically the case for JP much earlier than EP5 but because NA/Global got caps raised and gear/balancing that was meant for later combat we've grown accustomed to just face rolling content.

People will need to adjust expectations if they're going to want to continue to have fun with PSO2. Face rolling will not be a thing anymore.

@SeriPSO2

Since we're slightly off topic is there anyway for me to slap that Gunblade's heal strike on more than one thing? Or can I only do that with the augment factor and not the potential?

@Knight-Raime You can move S-class abilities around weapons as long as they have the relevant slots. Forgot the exact name but it's one of the options at Dudu/Monica.

Edit: went and checked, it's "Transfer S-grade augment". Basically you could affix the gunslash with the S4, use that to transfer the S4 to the weapon you want that has a S4 slot, then reaffix the gunslash with the S4 and so so. On just move it around.

@Blade-Syphon said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November): Like Satori already mentioned, Extremely Hard is the naming for both JP and EN. On top of the fact that XH is the common abbreviation used more often to reference the difficulty level compared to EX. So that's just a big "hmm" moment.

I suggested Extremely Hard be re-translated as Ultimate because that's LITERALLY what it is. Bewitched Woods on EX is essentially no different mechanically from what Ultimate Nevarius, Amduskia, and Lilipa were - a single map designed to spawn large amounts of bosses and trash for the sole purpose of farming them endlessly for drops. There is nothing different between how Bewitched Woods on EX works, than how the Ultimate Quests do. This is even more confusing for new players since EX Tokyo and Vegas are barely any more difficult than their Super Hard counterparts, and can easily be done solo.

Having a colloquial term to designate maps that are designed to be done in groups, rather than Solo, would alleviate problems like what we saw in the original topic.

Then you'd also proposed XH Tokyo, Vegas, and any of the future upcoming updates to free fields(Forest, Coasts, Tunnels, etc) to also be categorized as Ultimate Quests too?

I already mentioned what you see in XH EF's scaling is the standard scaling for XH contents. As the way multipliers applied towards free fields are different to the fixed scaling that Ultimate Nab/Lili/Amd have because with FF there are multiple difficulties and using a base value is multiplied by that corresponding difficulties' multiplier. You also overlooked that Vegas/Tokyo have monsters have stats of EP4 standards. You're comparing two entirely different episode monster's base stats and trying to make a valid statement when the base stats of EP5 monsters are much higher than that of EP4's so when the XH multiplier is applied, there's definitely a noticeable gap between the two even at XH difficulty.

Again, doesn't make sense just because just because Ult Nab/Lili/Amd slightly similar to that of FF. When at the time of EP3 where Ultimate Quests were introduced, it was intended to be challenging content for end game farming, but the later episodes dismissed that ideal of it end game farming since the idea of how end game gears changed.

You're exaggerating in it's difficulty because that's literally what you're doing. Bewitched Woods isn't some kind of epic raid content that requires you to go in with BiS gear, move with a group and coordinate with mechanically difficult bosses that require coordination. It's, as I said before, literally an Ultimatae Quest where you farm, and isn't designed to be done solo, which was my point. I went in with a group, we farmed, I was in no point in any danger of dying due to how easy the bosses are, and was able to BS with some friends on Discord while mindlessly murdering things for drops.

That's not challenging. Saying you need to go in with multiple people does not make it challenging. It just means that it's content designed with multiplayer in mind. That's like saying that a 5-man in WoW or (even more laughably) 4-man content in XIV is difficult because it's not designed to be soloed. No one is going to say that, and saying Bewitched Woods requires a group to efficiently farm in it does not make it a "Wake up call" or make it difficult, no more so than the Ultimate quests did in Episode 3.

And lastly, yes, I did go in when it launched on EX and tried to solo it, and quickly realized due to the enemies inflated health pools that it functioned like an Ultimate, and that it would be laughably inefficient to try to continue to solo farm. To further this point, I also soloed the final boss in Bewtiched Woods on EX. If this was truly the difficult wake up call you said it was, than this shouldn't have been possible, right? Or at the very least no in the timely manner of a few minutes as I did it in. Again - the same as Ultimate quests. I almost always finished my runs in Ultimate with killing the expedition boss once my group left, mostly because I found the fight to be extremely fun.

Can you exactly point which part of my comments I've stated that such exaggeration that it's a raid-level content that requires BiS gears. Quite a claim when you need to re-read thoroughly what myself and others have said. No one is saying you need the best of the best and a top group because it's the most difficult content nor was that implied at all in any of the comments made regarding what you're talking about. Besides, I mentioned Val because it's accessible and customizable with ssa but has much lower base than that of other EP5 series. I didn't mention Ray/Union even though those two are also applicable for low denominator weapon series because it was in reply to Knight-Raime and their current status.

The entire point was what I already said before, the shift from regular SH FF contents to their XH are noticeably different and newbies or anyone underestimating that without any prior knowledge or insight before going in will struggle, so if you're one of them and plan to solo while not well prepared, your experience won't be the same as if you were running SH FF with gears not even subpar. For the newbies, it's indeed a wake up call for them that the way they approach the content should be different that of how they were approach previous difficulties. Is that not true? As the player cannot enter the area and sweep sectors of mobs one after the other quickly. If you don't understand despite the reason being repeated to you many times I can't really help you here.

There was also no one here implying that even it couldn't be it's impossible to solo because content wasn't intended to solo. So you claiming that my argument meant 'you couldn't clear it" is heavily skewed and misinterpreted when you already supported my point by saying it was inefficient to farm solo which was what some of us were referencing towards, where there's a clear that going in solo requires a lot of effort. FF in general is intended to be cleared feasibly or enable continuous grinding. So in your anecdote doesn't disprove anything, just because you're not dying and having less issue doesn't mean the newbie who's new to the area isn't struggling on a regular basis.

@SeriPSO2 said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

Also, Omega bosses spawn are considered new as they are EP 5 bosses. It is just they are an upgrade from their oracle form when it comes to certain aspects such as attacks and may have different ele weakness.

The only truly new boss from the Episode 5 story is Apprentice. Elder, Luther, and Gemini's Omega forms are almost identical to their original counterparts, just with one additional enrage phase on each, and compared to Anga Phandage (with the possible exception of Apprentice), they're complete push overs.

??? What does Anga have to do with Omega bosses being new bosses. I was referencing the Dark Fal bosses in that quote as they don't exist anywhere else so far other than EP5 contents. Also, do you see A Demon, Golem anywhere else outside of EP5 related contents? They are considered boss as they are spawned in Boss Emergency Trials.

My point was that for players that are literally able to do only the most basic of content, don't bother to learn enemy attack patterns, builds, or use anything other than the crappy 12* weapons they get from UQ, then yes, Bewitched Wood on EX is going to be extremely difficult, and they're going to find most of their time in it on the floor. But for literally ANYONE who has actually played the game in some capacity at end game and actually tried to learn, Bewitched Woods EX is essentially no different than an Ultimate quest in terms of difficulty and expectation, which is why I called you out on somehow saying they're "Wake up calls".

Is that not the point of what others and I have stated? No one here indicated everyone aren't capable of clearing it ever. When it's about the initial response under prepared people will get when attempting it. So the way you continue to try and twist the words because you weren't able to grasp the point of my comment is baffling really. The talk was never really about anyone else but those who are not prepared for it yet and entering it without any insight. At this point it's you trying to argue for the sake of arguing when you've already have insight how XH content can be and also probably prepared for it both skill-wise and gear-wise. Not to mention proving what's been said here.

You're not calling anyone out because you're too focus on what specific words that actual point flew over your head leading to all these claims heavily skewed because you felt it applied to you. You're reading too deep into it and twisting what is in front of you.

Trying to apply yourself to what someone new faces doesn't help your argument because you already have insight, but they don't.

And please stop comparing games like XIV to here when both games are conceptually different. PSO2 is more akin towards games like MonHun as the base concept reflects similar elements. XIV and WoW are quite different from what PSO2 is.

MonHun and PSO2 leaves the option to solo and focuses on skill-based game play where gear is act as leverage. The other two are cookie cutter in terms of how MMORPGS are revolved. So the concept and design to what is considered difficult are vastly different from each others. When one gauges based on teamplay and mechanics while the other is how you'll deal X enemy/gimmick and working around that.

@Knight-Raime Starting from Atlas, they have access to a new ssa slot and each have their own unique S4 as SAF that's gain when it's +35.

So the answer would be yes, you can put S4 on any other weapon that have access to a S4 slot via S-abilities transfer option. When it comes to SAF on weapons, any weapon that have ssa as their SAF are expendable as you don't need to sacrifice the weapon to transfer it to other weapons and can always gain it back by re-affixing it back on the weapon.

BUT do note that your Atlas gs will downslot if the weapon the s4 is being transferred to does not have an existing s4 ability on it since you're basically subtracting one ability and adding to other. You will need to have the other weapon with a s4 on it so there's no downslot for either weapon.

Potential is irrelevant when it comes to SAF transfer, etc.

EDIT: So atm, you can only transfer S4 vampiric to other Atlas and Novel until more series that are S4 applicable are released.

The hardest mode of the woods us easier than the old ultimates imo. Thier are no elephants and everything hits much less hard. However I'm still not on board with AI partners because of the enemy hp and robbing people of rare drop exp boosts.

You don't pay my sub

@AwkwardSatori said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

@Knight-Raime You can move S-class abilities around weapons as long as they have the relevant slots. Forgot the exact name but it's one of the options at Dudu/Monica.

Edit: went and checked, it's "Transfer S-grade augment". Basically you could affix the gunslash with the S4, use that to transfer the S4 to the weapon you want that has a S4 slot, then reaffix the gunslash with the S4 and so so. On just move it around.

@SeriPSO2 said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

@Knight-Raime Starting from Atlas, they have access to a new ssa slot and each have their own unique S4 as SAF that's gain when it's +35.

So the answer would be yes, you can put S4 on any other weapon that have access to a S4 slot via S-abilities transfer option. When it comes to SAF on weapons, any weapon that have ssa as their SAF are expendable as you don't need to sacrifice the weapon to transfer it to other weapons and can always gain it back by re-affixing it back on the weapon.

BUT do note that your Atlas gs will downslot if the weapon the s4 is being transferred to does not have an existing s4 ability on it since you're basically subtracting one ability and adding to other. You will need to have the other weapon with a s4 on it so there's no downslot for either weapon.

Potential is irrelevant when it comes to SAF transfer, etc.

EDIT: So atm, you can only transfer S4 vampiric to other Atlas and Novel until more series that are S4 applicable are released.

I guess maybe I wasn't clear. I'll try again. If I want S4 Vampiric on more than one weapon at one time can I just do that with one Gunslash? Or would I need multiple ones?