Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November)

If you really don't want to deal with Casual Players simply go to Matching Settings when you select the quest and you can check a box so you'll enter a room where Allies/NPCs aren't allowed. You're more likely to find players that are grinding for weapons there than when you select the area normally.

Even though it came out last week and it might not show up as part of the Recommended Quests, it'll still be considerate of you to treat Casual Players in the Bewtiched Woods with kid gloves and not be overly demanding or strict on these players when they start exploring these quests on Extremely Hard. This will be the time where a quest like this will be the first time these players encounter a quest that plays like the Ultimate Quests, especially if they never touch Ultimate Quests at all. Even though Tokyo and Las Vegas has Extremely Hard difficulties, they're not as tough as Bewitched Woods is going to be when players enter them for the first time and will find out the hard way the true difference between Super Hard and Extremely Hard enemies. But I feel like expert players will be even tougher on them than the enemies. What I propose that you do tomorrow when there's alot of players exploring these woods that haven't tried to do so because of a mission are these is to not block them for any of the following:

  • Bringing NPCs/Bots to the area: there may be some people who feel comfortable and safer with them around than other players since they can distract enemies sometimes. Not to mention it's hard to find someone who has a similar playstyle as them or have different goals regarding the area. Also again, this may basically be their first time going through a quest that acts more like an Ultimate Quest rather than a normal quest.
  • Not sticking with the "cycle" or whatever it's called: most of the casuals that come here are probably here to just complete area, not to grind out weapons. There may also be some players that would rather actually explore the area first before completing the level and sometimes that's best way to get the S-Rank.
  • Dying too much: Again this is probably their first time running into an area that acts like an Ultimate Quest, especially if they're the type of player who would avoid this, but still want to level up. Tokyo's and Las Vegas' Extremely Hard doesn't help them ease into it.
  • Having Auto Chat unrestricted or Auto Chat at all: A different kind of player but still could be casual, like the ones that like to explore, they have different ways of having fun. Some may say that's a better reason to get mad at them but I disagree, being considerate means respecting how other people play. The only time to get mad at them is if they're obnoxious or inappropriate about them.

So what should you do to tell them these things aren't normally welcome? Simply warn them once about that and only once, no need for everyone else around you to constantly chastise them about the way they're playing. If you really don't want to deal with casual players, like I wrote at the beginning, you can go to matching settings when you select the quest and enter a room where Allies/NPCs/Bots aren't allowed, that way you won't run into them at all. But if you want to help them learn about these things then there's a kinder way to go about this. Basically saying, "Next time don't bring the bots here," is a little better than saying "get rid of them, you're ruining it for everyone else."

The other way is to ignore them and revive them if you want to, but either way just let them play the game they want since I think most casual players don't even go to forums like this or even look up Youtube videos about what you should do in the area, which is why I'm asking you to be considerate and patient with them, at the very least for a month so they'll have enough time to learn. Also you may say that because they're level 75 they should've learned this stuff by now, but I think I can counter that you can level up really quickly in the game and the challenging stuff only just begun, so a chance of a casual player going into this mission like any other Exploration Mission is pretty high, because of the previous ones aren't that terribly difficult.

I'll be honest. I'll bring allies/NPCs into expeditions/explorations regardless, period. The exception being Ultimate quests (which aren't meant to be expeditions/explorations, but act like them. They're more meant to be a harder advance quest really.)

Dying too much: Again this is probably their first time running into an area that acts like an Ultimate Quest, especially if they're the type of player who would avoid this, but still want to level up. Tokyo's and Las Vegas' Extremely Hard doesn't help them ease into it.

Even though I'm pretty old to the game, this is something even I can't stop myself from doing from time to time. Sometimes I simply just get hit so much that it takes all of my mate items (if I'm hunter-sub.) I'm just not good with timing things usually. Which is why I tend to stay away from Fellwyrm, Quartz Dragon, Angel/Luther and Ex/X-Dragon. It's also why I tend to prefer classes with high survivability and/or auto parries/dodges (Bouncer/Etoile/etc.)

I've been trying to time things properly in action games for years, and years and years. (More than a decade or two, since I'm 34 years old abouts.) It's just something I simply cannot do properly. Which is why I prefer RPGs. Especially ones that don't scale to your level/etc.

Also, I would be willing to join non-NPC expeditions if and only if we can get EXP while dead. Because players CAN TURN OFF THE INCAPACITATION INDICATOR if they don't want to see other players that have been incapacitated.

Let me repeat that...

PLAYERS CAN TURN OFF THE INCAPACITATION INDICATOR

The first option disables you seeing other players' little black-red exclamation point icons above their downed bodies. (Disabling overrides option 2.)

The second option disallows OTHER players to see YOUR little black-red exclamation point icon. (If option 1 is set to "Display" for the other players.)

I’m pretty casual myself but it’s because of that I’m not comfortable leveling in the spooky forest. Players with a ton of NPCs isn’t a good replacement for a map full of players, I struggle to take down bosses and it feels like no one is around. I know I should just bring my own real party for an easier time but it feels like the map should have everyone working towards a common goal. I always find myself alone in a “full” map. Even if it’s faster leveling, I don’t like that so I level someplace else.

@coldreactive said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

I'll be honest. I'll bring allies/NPCs into expeditions/explorations regardless, period. The exception being Ultimate quests (which aren't meant to be expeditions/explorations, but act like them. They're more meant to be a harder advance quest really.)

Dying too much: Again this is probably their first time running into an area that acts like an Ultimate Quest, especially if they're the type of player who would avoid this, but still want to level up. Tokyo's and Las Vegas' Extremely Hard doesn't help them ease into it.

Even though I'm pretty old to the game, this is something even I can't stop myself from doing from time to time. Sometimes I simply just get hit so much that it takes all of my mate items (if I'm hunter-sub.) I'm just not good with timing things usually. Which is why I tend to stay away from Fellwyrm, Quartz Dragon, Angel/Luther and Ex/X-Dragon. It's also why I tend to prefer classes with high survivability and/or auto parries/dodges (Bouncer/Etoile/etc.)

I've been trying to time things properly in action games for years, and years and years. (More than a decade or two, since I'm 34 years old abouts.) It's just something I simply cannot do properly. Which is why I prefer RPGs. Especially ones that don't scale to your level/etc.

Also, I would be willing to join non-NPC expeditions if and only if we can get EXP while dead. Because players CAN TURN OFF THE INCAPACITATION INDICATOR if they don't want to see other players that have been incapacitated.

Let me repeat that...

PLAYERS CAN TURN OFF THE INCAPACITATION INDICATOR

The first option disables you seeing other players' little black-red exclamation point icons above their downed bodies. (Disabling overrides option 2.)

The second option disallows OTHER players to see YOUR little black-red exclamation point icon. (If option 1 is set to "Display" for the other players.)

Well, it looks like it's about to start soon. Anyway, I'm going to bring NPCs to the area as well if I can't get my brother to explore with me, because that's how I normally play. I'm not going to change that since this is something that everyone is going to go play in anyway. This sort of makes me wish there's a recruiting tab like in Warframe where you can ask for help from random players and not just shout to the heavens in the lobby and hope for the best. Especially as an X-Box player since typing words is very slow for me and communicating how you're going to play is going to be different than what's normally going to happen when players go to this level for. Either way even if the good loot is pretty low because of it, that doesn't change that there's a chance that it could happen anyway.

I actually prefer to know when people die so I can revive them. I'm sure the hard limit should be around 3 times per person, but I still prefer to know when people are killed, especially from Auto Chats. Since the chaos of battle makes it hard for me to even notice these markings until I managed to find a place to heal or it's over. No one deserves to have a lower score or miss out on loot because of it.

@Milk said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

I’m pretty casual myself but it’s because of that I’m not comfortable leveling in the spooky forest. Players with a ton of NPCs isn’t a good replacement for a map full of players, I struggle to take down bosses and it feels like no one is around. I know I should just bring my own real party for an easier time but it feels like the map should have everyone working towards a common goal. I always find myself alone in a “full” map. Even if it’s faster leveling, I don’t like that so I level someplace else.

Yeah I can definitely see an expert player would tell you to do a lower difficulty as a reply to this but I think I would ask you about how comfortable you are at fighting the end boss of the area? If you're confident, you can warp to where the other players are and just hang around them without needing to actually join their party and when they pass by the exit and you feel ready to leave, you can rush towards the end and complete it. Another way about hanging around other players is that you can use the telepipe to recharge your Half-Scape Dolls if you have enough. Either way, as far as I know the only common goal I see in this area is circling around the area and grinding bosses for gear, and not complete the level if that's what you meant by common goal.

Also serious note. I just went into extremely hard Omega Forest with the no allies setting. And I sat there for about an hour or so on Ship 3. Only one person came in, they stayed for about 5 minutes then immediately left because we weren't progressing as fast as they wanted to. (Plus enemies only gave like 2k, even with boosts, which is less than Grade 3 Buster.)

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I know it's not "Prime Time." But really, this is a global PSO2.

By the way, this Emergency Code really needs a timer on it so these despawn after a while, and the devs can get data on how OP that healing golem is. (By the way, I had full 10 / 10 / 10 -mate items (the first three icons on my sub-palette there on the left.) Now I have basically nothing. Shows how much I get hit.

Not to mention how powerful the healing Spectres are:

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Might as well never bother unless you go in with a pre-formed that will most likely just disband after an hour or so of killing things because people don't care for how little EXP/etc. they get.

people don't like changing their match up settings, that's the experience i've made. generally. if you go into this type of content with your npcs/bots, thinking they're in any way helping you, you're wrong. if you go into this type of content thinking you will get good XP/Hour, you're also wrong.

the bewitched forest, or enchanted forest/woods, is simply a means to farm rares.nothing else.

so if you go into this and bring your NPCs because you don't want to be alone, make sure to set the active recruitment setting so that real, actual useful players, can replace your NPCs at some point.

if that is still not good enough, and you hate playing with others, there is always the option to set a password and restrict others from joining you, MPAs included.

there seriously is no excuse to not follow those little rules in content types where everyone knows that Enemies have HP pools directed towards MPAs and also hit like trucks.

@ShAdOnIc said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

if you go into this type of content thinking you will get good XP/Hour, you're also wrong.

Well, thanks for telling me. Now I'll never step foot in it again. I'll just do buster quests, seasonal events, and level-up quests.

If you're gonna run it on EH and you can barely play the game, I don't think it's the expedition to be doing. When I say barely, I mean being unable to hold your own at all. There's a lot of quests that aren't as intense and as a casual, I doubt you want to grind it for anything other than the bingo card, which anyone can do on easier difficulties.

I do have to say too, NPCs aren't all that helpful in most situations. It's good to bring them to boost their bars or for rations, but otherwise they don't really do a whole lot. And as far as auto-chats go, a lot of people find them annoying and others don't. Just don't force them to display in local chat and don't be a cringe lord about it. To put it bluntly, no one gives a shit about your loli fetish or your cosplay character's in-universe RPs. Otherwise if they're harmless and limited to party chat, you should be OK (as long as you don't comment on rare drops lol).

@Guilrel

You have some good ideas. By “common goal” the players in the area never seem to be around for the code emergency bosses. I can beat them by myself but it’s a lot slower paced leveling my character that way and starts to feel counterproductive. I might try again when I want loot but right now I’ve got four characters to level.

@coldreactive if you have problems with evading then go and play with Summoner, this class requires less skills than others, doesn't have JAs and the only thing you need to fully use the class is knowledge of the class tree and the pets also a good Summoner is like a cockroach and can survive against any kind of attack without dying even party wipe attacks

It's a common misconception that all explorations are easy, EP5's content was the breaking point to how XH contents are scaled. XH Enchanted Forest was intended for MPAs, and not for soloing. Sure you can go in solo but be prepared to struggle. Even with AI, which are quite weak and honestly won't help at all other than buffs (if Fo or Te) and distribute aggro (which is lost immediately once you attack that enemy).

XH Enchanted Forest will is what you will experience at future content. Where the HP pools are scaled much higher, the stats of enemies have a higher multiplier which means it's easy to overwhelm the average player.

What @ShAdOnIc mentioned is correct, there are many other settings for those who uses AI partners to set that would be more beneficiary than 8 players having to deal with that 1 player using 3 other AI which can't be replaced.

No.

NPCs are bad, Woods aren't even in the daily rotations so they don't get that excuse, and the enemies have Ultimate scaling. Bully the shit out of them until they stop bringing NPCs.

Well good news for Expert players it looks like the Bewitched Woods will never be on the Recommended Quests since today just looped right back into Forest. Although it wouldn't surprised that an influx of casuals will still happen if they decided to have a campaign for it after the maintenance, especially for Halloween.

@coldreactive
Yeah, what happened to you is what happened to me when I tried to do Ultimate Quest as Braver/Fighter and what got me started on my main class of Hunter/Bouncer, because being able to use Healing Techs help you stay in the fight more than items and not having to go back to the ship every 10 seconds because you used them all up since you're not good at dodging and attacking at the right time yet.

@ShAdOnIc said in Please be Considerate to Casual Players in the Bewitched Woods Exploration Quests (at the very least until the end of November):

people don't like changing their match up settings, that's the experience i've made. generally. if you go into this type of content with your npcs/bots, thinking they're in any way helping you, you're wrong. if you go into this type of content thinking you will get good XP/Hour, you're also wrong.

the bewitched forest, or enchanted forest/woods, is simply a means to farm rares.nothing else.

so if you go into this and bring your NPCs because you don't want to be alone, make sure to set the active recruitment setting so that real, actual useful players, can replace your NPCs at some point.

if that is still not good enough, and you hate playing with others, there is always the option to set a password and restrict others from joining you, MPAs included.

there seriously is no excuse to not follow those little rules in content types where everyone knows that Enemies have HP pools directed towards MPAs and also hit like trucks.

The thing about casual players is that they'll probably never know how hard this quest is nor how unadvisable it is to bring NPCs until they go to it. Hopefully the area not being a part of the Recommended Quests cycle is a good clue to how different this area is compared to others, but I hope if there's a campaign for it, they will say it's okay to complete the campaign on lower difficulties. One of the requirements is being able to unlock Very Hard mode after all.

Anyway those are good tips, I would like to add when you're making a party beacon it is best to say whether you're going to complete the area or grind, otherwise players will probably be not be happy that your goal is completely different from theirs's and I'm not sure if it's true or not that beating the boss of the area will make enemies stop spawning around you or not, since I never go back to the area from the Gateship after I'm finished with it.

@Milk
I think I can do the same when I do the quest as a Bouncer, and the area was alright for me when I through it as a Sword Hero Main. Just be careful alright.

@ApollosAmour
@SeriPSO2
Extremely Hard Woods will definitely be the surprise wake up call for them if they haven't done so already for the Bingo Cards. But that's all the more reason to be slightly patient with them, especially if they're here to complete the area instead of grinding.

@BoJo-s-Bizzare-Adventures
That's good for getting rid of players but not making them better. I mean sure a few will get better though the "tough love" but I believe more will improve with people being patient. I believe the only reason that "bullying" is justified, if they are also there to grind rather than complete the area.

I feel the XH version should have been separated from the other difficulties in order to let casuals and others see more clearly that it's not the usual easy brain dead expedition. I am a bit saddened that it wasn't included in the daily rotation, mostly considering the dailies require only up to SH to complete. But I understand why. Though again, XH shouldn't have been done like that.

I say this because regardless, casuals will still attempt the stage, and the players who know what they are doing will berate on them because they may be pretty much dead weight in there. Some casuals will switch gears and get better. Others will simply move on and let the stage be. And to those who move on, the SH version is fun to solo because the enemies are still tough for people with low tier gear, and the boss combinations showing up in stage (which are the Omega versions, so they have better stats), make things interesting. Sadly the boss at the end is quite underwhelming since he has only a small fraction of the HP the story variant has.

I only went into Enchanted once on XH and I wasn't dropping regular adds fast enough when dealing with a boss and eventually got overwhelmed even when other players were near by. This is the opposite of my experience from doing regular ultimate quests where I went to train myself as a Hero.

Frankly I don't know if this is because my gear isn't up to snuff or if it's really just because this is how things are going to be for all MPA content now since i've heard end of EP5/all of EP6 are stupidly spongy enemies.

(I'm a level 90 hero with max grinded stella walls, max grinded Val farder, and max grinded Fornis TMG's/Talis.)