Fellwyrm is terribly designed

I liked this fight a lot but it shows how bad the lock-on/targeting system is in this game. I noticed that on this boss specifically it's better to not use the "hard" lock-on but the "soft" lock-on because many times the "hard" lock-on will be on one if its non-weakpoints (toes mostly). Add to that the amount of movement this boss does makes the "hard" lock-on a total nightmare to utilize aside from the short phases when its head is down.

So instead of "fixing" this boss which is definitely not the issue, it will be better in the long run to just make the targeting system in this game something that is actually good and not the abomination of a targeting system that we have now.

@Miraglyth To add to the list of oddities, I had one instance yesterday of countering the Dragon during his dive bomb strikes across the map where I seemingly succeeded and failed.

Assumed I failed the timing as my body was tossed like a rag doll in a spin cycle, but my BR had the purple aura and gear released. Maybe this lends credence to your multiple hits in quick succession theory?

As for first impressions, I thought they did a good job capturing how long, tough and chaotic it'd be to take on a dragon. This isn't to say I loved all the mechanics, but it felt like a fight worthy of a dragon (sort of like the mult-staged fight against Midir (sp?) in the Ringed City DLC of Dark Souls 3...rough fight but you felt like a dragon slayer afterwards).

@Rang-Dipkin said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

but my BR had the purple aura and gear released. Maybe this lends credence to your multiple hits in quick succession theory

I'm somewhat relieved others are having similar experiences! I haven't had the chance to take it on again. Might record it just so I can get a headstart on feedback about what's happening here.

@Jamesmor said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

@BronzeAgeBrain said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

My first problem is the same problem most big stuff has in this game, the camera and weak spots. Things like locking onto his head and therefore not being able to see his body or the death bubbles below you, or trying to lock onto the weak spots on his ankles and just picking up his feet. When things get big, force you to lock on to hit places, AND require you to watch carefully things have always been wonky. This boss is no exception. If you want me reading snap tells or eating dirt, please let me do that and not force my camera up his nose.

doing this fight a few times I found out that you should not aim in his head unless he is knocked out, unless you are using Summoner that their pets ignore all the body and hit the weakspot directly all other classes won't deal much damage in his head and like you said you can't see a thing while aiming there, also to deal with the other weak spots get closer aim there and use Hero mobility tricks to get away, remember that you can teleport using Talis

I used talis a lot for the fight. The mobility on the PA can be clutch in several parts like setting up a teleport to dodge when he goes into one of his drive by phases. The issue is it’s a lock on dependent weapon more so than something like the sword so you end up forced into the camera problems. In theory you could reduce a lot of that by maintaining altitude and going at it from there, but I’d have to try that out before saying it’s a good solution. Personally I use controller because these days prolonged WASD use makes my left hand cramp, but I assume if you do some direct aiming you could make things work nice.

@NotWhoUThink said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

Using air reversal is actually not the smart thing to do, there are very little I-Frames during air reversal and it's very possible to get hit during it.

The i-frames are quite generous, you just need to not immediately cancel it with an attack or movement the moment you press the space bar if you want to be safe for a short time.

its old game wait til new genesis

I do have a valid question about the Black Felwyrm fight - is there any way to speed up the invulnerabiltiy phase he has after you leap up to chase after him after the first round of weakpoint breaking?

I'm pretty sure I'm missing something when I did it, but my group ended up wasting a good solid few minutes on both Phase 1 and Phase 2 waiting for a weakpoint to spawn - is it conditional based on his HP, or do you have to specifically target the areas that become weak points, or is it something else I'm missing entirely that has to be done with the Laconium Sword.

Once the weak points spawn, it's pretty self explanatory - charge sword, break weak point, drop sword and pew pew. It's that period of time where no weak points spawn that I'm confused at what you're supposed to do, exactly.

@Blade-Syphon I think the no weak pts after the turret phase could be a bug that happens if teams are not fast enough to break both wings. It sucks but you gotta break another toe nail to un-break the bug and make the tail weak spot pop up.

As for this fight, It has been a lot more fun than I expected. Almost all his attacks have pretty big tells except for the tail swipe since it's harder to see sometimes with all the chaos. It has been great practice for my ranger and getting used to crimson's pace actually sped up my ranger gameplay to where I could actually go back deal with phaleg 10x easier.

@Duymon said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

@Blade-Syphon I think the no weak pts after the turret phase could be a bug that happens if teams are not fast enough to break both wings. It sucks but you gotta break another toe nail to un-break the bug and make the tail weak spot pop up.

That would explain it. My group did have a player running around with the sword not actually using it properly during the Turret phase, which ended up making it take two fly overs before we moved onto the next phase. That's...a lovely annoyance to have to deal with in PuGs.

@Duymon said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

@Blade-Syphon I think the no weak pts after the turret phase could be a bug that happens if teams are not fast enough to break both wings. It sucks but you gotta break another toe nail to un-break the bug and make the tail weak spot pop up.

that's by design if you're unable to break both wings. JP has been that way since release, and you're correct that breaking the other nail exposes the blue spots that can then be broken with laconium sword. @Blade-Syphon said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

That would explain it. My group did have a player running around with the sword not actually using it properly during the Turret phase, which ended up making it take two fly overs before we moved onto the next phase. That's...a lovely annoyance to have to deal with in PuGs.

interestingly enough, the laconium waves can hit the fireball from the ground. it's common for whoever has it to do this in preparation for the dragon landing to immediately expose the second wing. not saying this person wasn't being dumb, i'm sure they were if they're just running around lol

I just wish the Laconiam sword would have actually done all the things we see Alis do in cutscenes aside from the sealing part. We see her fly around and shoot a bunch of photon blade like projectiles, yet all we can do is use one photon art, block/counter and the normal swordbeam attack when we use it.

So far my death counts: (Red Dragon, since I have no 80 characters.)

  • First Run: 22 (Couldn't use the sword. No one let me. I died on the last phase.)
  • Second Run: 21 (Died twice using the sword.
  • Third Run: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Y-tlUqFClo
  • Fourth Run: 14 (Died 8 times using the sword.)
  • Fifth Run: 16 (Died 5 times using the sword.) (I also had to block someone this run because they had auto chat on EVERYTHING.)

Every single time I've run out of Moon Atomizers 2/3 of the way into the quest. (From Max Moon Atomizers.) No one believers me, ever. I know the mechanics. I don't need a guide. I'm just terrible at it.

@coldreactive said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

So far my death counts: (Red Dragon, since I have no 80 characters.)

  • First Run: 22 (Couldn't use the sword. No one let me. I died on the last phase.)
  • Second Run: 21 (Died twice using the sword.
  • Third Run: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Y-tlUqFClo
  • Fourth Run: 14 (Died 8 times using the sword.)
  • Fifth Run: 16 (Died 5 times using the sword.) (I also had to block someone this run because they had auto chat on EVERYTHING.)

Every single time I've run out of Moon Atomizers 2/3 of the way into the quest. (From Max Moon Atomizers.) No one believers me, ever. I know the mechanics. I don't need a guide. I'm just terrible at it.

couple pointers:

-most importantly, i don't think i saw you use blight rounds a single time. at 10/10 it gives you 6 rounds with a 90 second cd, so you can use it pretty generously in this EQ on the boss's weak points. it gives a 20% damage increase to anyone in the MPA who hits it and lasts 18 seconds or until the part is broken.

-are you using hunter sub? i recommend skilling automate halfline to automatically heal you so you don't need to stand around using mate items. pretty important as a sub class skill for a class like ranger. hunter's physique is also very useful for ranger.

-you seemed to be pretty inconsistent with Perfect Attacks. i'd recommend using rockbear to get a feel for them since they're very important for increasing your damage, especially with hunter sub.

-the dive roll action has a small number of i-frames to help you dodge attacks. i saw you use it a couple times to avoid fireballs, but the vast majority of attacks, you were just running into not trying to dodge at all.

-i strongly recommend trying some other PAs like positron beam, piercing round (while being in the air), and impact slider. steady shot's dps is ok, but spamming it the whole UQ isn't a good idea.

-launcher's charged divine launcher-0 is very strong for taking out all the mobs during the beginning of the UQ

@Milranduil said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

-you seemed to be pretty inconsistent with Perfect Attacks. i'd recommend using rockbear to get a feel for them since they're very important for increasing your damage, especially with hunter sub.

I'm not good with timing, and never will be. Period. Ever. Even if I practice 8 hours a day. (Believe me. I've tried this way back in Super Mario RPG. I've tried this for FFXIV on Extreme content. I've tried this on so many things. It. Doesn't. Work. For. Me.)

-launcher's charged divine launcher-0 is very strong for taking out all the mobs during the beginning of the UQ

Can't take out mobs if they die within 3 seconds.

I was just leveling Gunner (Since I hate TMGs.) And was using Rifle instead. My hunter is still like, 55. Right now I'm working on Braver, now that Gunner is 75 (And I never want to touch it again.) Similarly, I will never main Phantom, I will level it, but I'll never main it.

@coldreactive said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

I'm not good with timing, and never will be. Period. Ever. Even if I practice 8 hours a day. (Believe me. I've tried this way back in Super Mario RPG. I've tried this for FFXIV on Extreme content. I've tried this on so many things. It. Doesn't. Work. For. Me.)

the game is going to get exponentially worse for you then because ultra hard and EP6 enemies don't come to play games. dragon is a wake up call for NA.

@coldreactive said in Fellwyrm is terribly designed:

Can't take out mobs if they die within 3 seconds.

no idea what this has to do with anything. you can pre-charge divine-0 to hit mobs very far away the moment they spawn. things are dying in 3 seconds on super hard for you because it's... super hard. this is not how endgame is.