RMT spambots seem to have a new workflow now?

@Anarchy-Marine said in RMT spambots seem to have a new workflow now?:

@Gamers-are-so-oppressed No, because they aren't directly naming people in ban waves. It's a legality regarding ones rights to privacy, regardless of a ToS breach, or a User agreement breach. Any digitally signed contract, is between you and the service provider. They reserve the rights to cancel that service, at any time, for any reason, just like a stores rights to refuse public service, only in this case, the online services, can and will use their signed agreement to fall back on, as a reason for the termination of service, as it is a legally binding contract. As such, it's legally binding both ways, as corporations, by law, can't publicly slander, or shame any player, banned from it's service, that's why they are vague when talking about offenders whom are in breach of said contract.

Right, no direct naming. So a Steam tag would be fine kind of like the Rainbow 6 example it is their Uplay account? They list the reason in the video as well specifically for boosting. For the BDO example they list the character/in-game family name along with the reasoning "Violating the Operation Policy". I guess what I'm confused on now is what makes Sega different in this scenario? They don't do this type of thing right now no, but if other companies can do this, I don't see why Sega could not aside from the fact they just don't want to.

The harassment I could see happening but that ultimately falls on the player doing the harassing versus the company. They can attempt to sue the company but I could not see that ending well as plenty of other people have tried suing over bans via other games/services PSN/Xbox Live/etc.

@Gamers-are-so-oppressed said in RMT spambots seem to have a new workflow now?:

Why don't they just buy Meseta the legal way through Sega's lootboxes?

ive easily put 500 dollars so far into the scratches and have a return of about 1.2b meseta so seems like a good idea for me to do this but not everyone likes RNG xP

I make between 24-31m meseta just doing dailies and weeklies. Without scratches. It just takes time and commitment, that I'm sad to say, not everyone is able to do.

And most expensive prices are from scratches that are long past, or rewards that were only giving out once and were stored.

@Gamers-are-so-oppressed said in RMT spambots seem to have a new workflow now?:

Right, no direct naming. So a Steam tag would be fine kind of like the Rainbow 6 example it is their Uplay account? They list the reason in the video as well specifically for boosting. For the BDO example they list the character/in-game family name along with the reasoning "Violating the Operation Policy". I guess what I'm confused on now is what makes Sega different in this scenario? They don't do this type of thing right now no, but if other companies can do this, I don't see why Sega could not aside from the fact they just don't want to.

The harassment I could see happening but that ultimately falls on the player doing the harassing versus the company. They can attempt to sue the company but I could not see that ending well as plenty of other people have tried suing over bans via other games/services PSN/Xbox Live/etc.

No, Steam tags would not be fine, because some directly link their Steam tags to their social media, either by name, or through links, as a way for their friends to find them. This will lead to real life harassment.

Your also missing my point by a mile. A game that auto lists a tag, like your example of Uplay does, will mean that a player could find and harass a player for whatever reason, and the fault, and legality would fall solely on the one harassing the other person. Even the company behind those games don't directly name names, in ban waves. Fallout 76 is another good example of this. People are banned, but they never directly state who was in the ban wave.

BDO can't be used as an example, as your family name can be whatever you want it to be, and thusly you aren't directly naming the account linked to the family name. That's called a legal loophole, one I don't personally agree with.

It only legally falls on the company, when an account outside the jurisdiction of the game, and company, I.E. a Steam team tag, is directly listed in the ban wave. Which is why they never directly list them.

@Anarchy-Marine said in RMT spambots seem to have a new workflow now?:

No, Steam tags would not be fine, because some directly link their Steam tags to their social media, either by name, or through links, as a way for their friends to find them. This will lead to real life harassment.

The link to social media is for locating friends yes, as in, these are people you are already friends with and know on social media that have steam linked as well and you should add them. So unless the harasser is already friends with them on facebook.... I don't see why this matters?

https://store.steampowered.com/news/5644/

While I don't agree that you should go harass someone after they are banned, unless you literally spam your tag all over your social and for whatever reason would add this person on your social account, that would be on the victim. There is a reason all of these programs and sites generally tell you to create a unique account name. Do I believe the harasser is in the right? No.

Your also missing my point by a mile. A game that auto lists a tag, like your example of Uplay does, will mean that a player could find and harass a player for whatever reason, and the fault, and legality would fall solely on the one harassing the other person.Even the company behind those games don't directly name names, in ban waves. Fallout 76 is another good example of this. People are banned, but they never directly state who was in the ban wave.

I don't understand I'm in agreement here? They do not directly naming IRL names. A steam username / tag is not a name (at least I would hope not, in a perfect world? Sure, but we are definitely not in a perfect world). It works just like a Uplay account. Steam even lists VAC bans on people's profiles openly.

It only legally falls on the company, when an account outside the jurisdiction of the game, and company, I.E. a Steam team tag, is directly listed in the ban wave. Which is why they never directly list them.

Would Steam not be involved in some way with hosting their game on the store? Do you have any kind of source for this one? Would like to read it over.

@Gamers-are-so-oppressed It's literally in the privacy policy/statement of every ToS online. What you do or don't agree with isn't what matters here. I already said why, and gave a decent enough response, that covered your questions both directions in regards to the legal definition of harassment, and who would be at fault, depending upon context.

Not trying to sound rude, but you can literally go and look all of this stuff up yourself, and see what a company can, and legally can't do. It's actually good to know what is, or isn't legal, because people wound up in legal battles in the past, because of not knowing different laws

@Anarchy-Marine said in RMT spambots seem to have a new workflow now?:

@Shirokami07 No, that would look bad for a professional company, as that's petty as hell. It would also go outside their reach of power, as it would cause harassment. Harassment that would rightfully lead to a lawsuit.

You're pretty out of the loop if you think what you type. Cheating people gets shamed often and more developers should do it. Good luck trying create a lawsuit for being proven you're cheater, that's like telling people you'll be sue'd over warning your neighborhood over a new sex predator that moved in.

People like you are a good morning joke.

@Pulptenks

He isn't wrong, being a company that would shame users cheating or not by calling out usernames directly giving them notoriety (which could lead to lawsuits) isn't exactly ideal. ..I mean is it really hard to guess who the people buying meseta are? (I am aware many people buy AC)

If I had to guess though it's some of those people you practically never see enter a mission and roll out with like 500m meseta worth of different gear on a regular basis. Unless they might acknowledge when asked if they scratch a lot of AC constantly dropping money on them it seems like there is no way they aren't.

@Anarchy-Marine said in RMT spambots seem to have a new workflow now?:

@Gamers-are-so-oppressed It's literally in the privacy policy/statement of every ToS online. Not trying to sound rude, but you can literally go and look all of this stuff up yourself, and see what a company can, and legally can't do. It's actually good to know what is, or isn't legal, because people wound up in legal battles in the past, because of not knowing different laws

I just asked for a source for one thing, if you can't provide one that is fine. I provided examples of what I've seen from other games that provide account names (Like UPlay, Steam names are account names) and how a steam name is not an IRL name. I never ever once said to use an IRL name, which again, a steam name is not an IRL name. The social media idea was also debunked and a source was provided. I don't believe you are actually looking at the sources or reading half of what I say.

What you do or don't agree with isn't what matters here. I already said why, and gave a decent enough response, that covered your questions both directions in regards to the legal definition of harassment, and who would be at fault, depending upon context.

I only had 1 question left, "Would Steam not be involved in some way with hosting their game on the store? Do you have any kind of source for this one?" Far as everything else goes, I've already shown how it could and can work with no repercussions for the company just as many other companies have done and still do.

Vac banned players lists are public and they include steam profile link and/or ID, examples: https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Banned_players http://www.vacbanned.com/listing/last

Esportal has a public ban list too: https://esportal.com/banned_players

And there are a plethora of other games where posting an uncensored proof is allowed (eg. archeage: http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?167885-Blocking-an-NPC-name-and-shame), sometimes encouraged too (eg. tree of savior: https://forum.treeofsavior.com/t/bot-report-at-irredian/415516).

Hiding the names of the abusers only gives them a chance to get away with it and do it again.

@condor Two of your links are competitive gaming, and when you sign up for those, you are no longer a private player, as you entered a public tournament. Different scenario. One of your lists, is a player who took it upon themselves to name and shame, something the GM's on this very forum have taken issue with in the past. And your last link, are RMT bots, and thusly, their ToS and User agreement signatures are void, as they aren't real players.

@Pulptenks Cheaters usually get shamed by other players, not by game companies. Also, wow, good job comparing a sex offender, to someone that cheated in a game. Those are on two different levels. A cheater temporarily hurts a players experience in a game, whereas a sex offender, hurts a person emotionally, and mentally for life.

@Gamers-are-so-oppressed Go read the privacy policy statement of each ToS, and User agreement ever. I shouldn't have to link any of them, when you are perfectly capable reading them. Steam is a separate entity from any game publisher they host, and thus the authority of bans, stops at the game itself. You will only get banned from Steam, if you directly violate their agreements. It's clear that you are attempting to turn this into an argument of some sort, and I'm done with the conversation.

@Anarchy-Marine VAC protects many games, those I posted are just examples, and any steam ID can be checked for VAC bans. Esportal is a matchmaking helper, it's not limited to "competitive gaming". As for archeage and tree of savior, they are, again, examples. You can search their forums to see many other examples and the last link is not an RMT bot, but a player using a bot that plays the game unattended (there are similar reports for player hacking of afking too, if you spend a minute searching).

Don't want to sound rude, but you don't seem to have played those games and making blind guesses to prove a point isn't going to help anyone.

@condor Give me an example, of a game developer/publisher, directly listing names in a ban wave.