Maining vs. Subbing

@MEGAF1UX said in Maining vs. Subbing:

ARPGs

Comparing a single player game to an MMO title is comparing apples and oranges. PSO2 has no single-player mode unlike PSO.

  • The Secret World's Weapon / Sub Weapon system is fine, sure. But the game itself had to be rebranded to save itself, then constant infrastructure and lag issues followed soon after, causing its collapse.
  • There are two DnD Online MMOs, the one I played, neverwinter, from Perfect World, doesn't have a sub-class system.
  • TROVE's sub-class system is laughable at best. You can choose an ability based on the sub-class you choose. ONE ABILITY. And not even an ability from the sub-class' ability / skill / whatever pool either, it's a sub-class specific ability to that class. There's no other ability options per class, just one static choice per class.
  • DoMO isn't as popular anymore either.
  • Runes of Magic (If you can consider it) basically died twice.

@coldreactive said in Maining vs. Subbing:

@MEGAF1UX said in Maining vs. Subbing:

ARPGs

Comparing a single player game to an MMO title is comparing apples and oranges. PSO2 has no single-player mode unlike PSO.

all 3 of those games i named have multiplayer. youre frankly out of your depth. dungeons and dragons online has sub classes and thats just off the top of my head (and is still running, not on some "private server"). aeria games had games that used them, i remember another sci-fi game that had them and a pretty silly steam punk one too. they are FAR from unique to these 2 games. lineage 2 had sub classes aswell (even if you arent willing to count them). ryzom had no sub classes, but you still leveled different classes. even guild wars had it.. i mean if we are talking JUST sub class ragnarok and most other korean games have them. but even if you MUST have dual class there no shortage of them at all.

if all you know is pop you arent really equipped to discuss the underground.

I would suggest just leveling up every class to 75 for the account bonus. And while doing that finding out what you like the best. Play around with the skill tree and then use a reset pass after everything is 75.

@MEGAF1UX said in Maining vs. Subbing:

i think the important part is to dispell the notion that you wouldnt want a sub-class (i have xbox friends who insisted that was their plan thinking that way they could "master" one class before moving on to another). perhaps it comes from games like titan quest, grim dawn, and dins curse, but in pso 2 there is absolutely no reason NOT to start working on a sub-class as soon as possible (that and getting your rings situated).

if/when they add the other classes that will change, but as it stands theres no point to worrying about content that isnt in the game.

For me I can't think of any game I've played digitally that had a Main/Sublclass system. Maybe multi-class. Which is arguably the same thing for purposes of two classes in consideration. But it was said best above where there is the tendancy, like in my case, to think that by maining only. I'm maximizing/dedicating a fix amount of total possible skill points allocatable to it by not spending part of it on a sub-class.

So I will definitely research the best bang for the main Ranger buck and go from there.

Thank you.

o/ =^.^=

@KnightHarb1nger said in Maining vs. Subbing:

@MEGAF1UX said in Maining vs. Subbing:

i think the important part is to dispell the notion that you wouldnt want a sub-class (i have xbox friends who insisted that was their plan thinking that way they could "master" one class before moving on to another). perhaps it comes from games like titan quest, grim dawn, and dins curse, but in pso 2 there is absolutely no reason NOT to start working on a sub-class as soon as possible (that and getting your rings situated).

if/when they add the other classes that will change, but as it stands theres no point to worrying about content that isnt in the game.

For me I can't think of any game I've played digitally that had a Main/Sublclass system. Maybe multi-class. Which is arguably the same thing for purposes of two classes in consideration. But it was said best above where there is the tendancy, like in my case, to think that by maining only. I'm maximizing/dedicating a fix amount of total possible skill points allocatable to it by not spending part of it on a sub-class.

So I will definitely research the best bang for the main Ranger buck and go from there.

Thank you.

o/ =^.^=

yea in some games that use dual class you get x points per level that you can either sink into your main class OR your sub class, and in those games it sometimes does make sense to stick strictly to the main to get bigger bonuses to the skills you use the most. pos2 isnt like that at all though, the exp doesnt feed part into the sub class or anything so you lose nothing by having one.

for ranger (or any other class really) heres the metas

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_pxozkfMvUY5C_5ih_tanWI-5iZFVHaB_F1LExvmB9Y/edit#gid=25896521

(hunter is a pretty good sub for anything)

So, I've been googling around trying to find info about class builds in pso2, not much out there. (at least in English) I saw this, and it look like it has interesting information, but it looks like it's old. (from the url)

https://guidescroll.com/2014/09/pso2-builds-guide/

Any vets know the site?

@Seedenator said in Maining vs. Subbing:

So, I've been googling around trying to find info about class builds in pso2, not much out there. (at least in English) I saw this, and it look like it has interesting information, but it looks like it's old. (from the url)

https://guidescroll.com/2014/09/pso2-builds-guide/

Any vets know the site?

It's definitely too old. Since Summoner isn't listed in the screenshots. Nor Bouncer

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_pxozkfMvUY5C_5ih_tanWI-5iZFVHaB_F1LExvmB9Y/edit#gid=1163868169 as close to current as youll get for a comprehensive list. one of the bad things about the internet is that information is all over the place instead of compiled nicely in logical folders.

also.. i have 12000X more respect for people who diy rather than using guides for everything.

I think the OP was asking , If you get 1SP from leveling up your main class, do you have to decide whether to put it in your main or sub class? Do you get 1 SP every time your sub class levels up?

@i48TonsOfSlaves yes. 1 sp for your main every time you level it up, and 1 sp for your sub every time you level IT up. i thought i made it pretty clear.

@coldreactive said in Maining vs. Subbing:

@MEGAF1UX said in Maining vs. Subbing:

ARPGs

Comparing a single player game to an MMO title is comparing apples and oranges. PSO2 has no single-player mode unlike PSO.

  • The Secret World's Weapon / Sub Weapon system is fine, sure. But the game itself had to be rebranded to save itself, then constant infrastructure and lag issues followed soon after, causing its collapse.
  • There are two DnD Online MMOs, the one I played, neverwinter, from Perfect World, doesn't have a sub-class system.
  • TROVE's sub-class system is laughable at best. You can choose an ability based on the sub-class you choose. ONE ABILITY. And not even an ability from the sub-class' ability / skill / whatever pool either, it's a sub-class specific ability to that class. There's no other ability options per class, just one static choice per class.
  • DoMO isn't as popular anymore either.
  • Runes of Magic (If you can consider it) basically died twice.

i didnt mention any of those games. tsw was one i thought about atleast, perfect world makes nothing BUT trash (or takes over good games and turns them to trash) so obviously they didnt make DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS ONLINE (not some easy-mode follow the glowy line because you dont know how to read garbage) turbine did, trove was a pay to win rip-off of cube world that SHOULD have just died, though i could point out that RIFT also had subclasses since we are talking about trion worlds, domo.... i thought was for 9 year olds, runes of magic also had them. so clearly they are not anything special, infact they are pretty normal and NOT something only found in "this game and final fantasy".

the notion that you couldnt compare single player games to multiplayer games was even more jarring to me personally. asif divine divinity was in any way inferior to diablo, or playing nba 2k games offline was SOOOO vastly different than playing them online. its REALLY easy to compare them infact. kingdoms of amalur is STILL an awesome game (with dual or even tri class..) regardless of it not being online.

so go ahead back and delete the "There are literally no other MMOs that have a Main+Sub Class system in the western market besides FFXI, PSO2 and private server-hosted old MMOs." post since its completely disproved at this point (and since youre such a huge fan of going back and editing).

@MEGAF1UX said in Maining vs. Subbing:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_pxozkfMvUY5C_5ih_tanWI-5iZFVHaB_F1LExvmB9Y/edit#gid=1163868169 as close to current as youll get for a comprehensive list. one of the bad things about the internet is that information is all over the place instead of compiled nicely in logical folders.

also.. i have 12000X more respect for people who diy rather than using guides for everything.

You do understand the difference between a guide, and a wiki, or just a reference site of some kind, right?

Many games have some kind of fan, or dev, site with lots of good info on how the game works.

I don't care about peoples fotm builds and min/maxing tips.

I don't even know what all the stupid abbreviations mean, I don't know what the different skills are, or what they do.

There is so little info about this game available, because there is so much you can't find what is relevant.

In the beta I randomly fed things to my little floaty dude, and used grinders on stuff I found to (I think) make it better. There is so little info available on HOW THINGS WORK that I couldn't be bothered to stress about what was "best" when it was time consuming enough to figure out how to do stuff.

I never even unlocked a subclass because I had no idea HOW. I knew I had to kill something/someone, I had no information on what they were or where they were. I had no good idea on where to GET that information. I did managed to kill one of the things I needed to, I have no idea when I did it, I looked at the status and saw that one was completed.

One of the good things about the internet is that like minded people can get together and gather information about something they care about, and share it. Sometimes finding such places is not as easy as it might be, but it would be wrong to say that everything is all over the place, sometimes it is compiled in nice logical places... it's like a treasure hunt.

... Watch out for Mimics and other lurking baddies.

@Seedenator said in Maining vs. Subbing:

@MEGAF1UX said in Maining vs. Subbing:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_pxozkfMvUY5C_5ih_tanWI-5iZFVHaB_F1LExvmB9Y/edit#gid=1163868169 as close to current as youll get for a comprehensive list. one of the bad things about the internet is that information is all over the place instead of compiled nicely in logical folders.

also.. i have 12000X more respect for people who diy rather than using guides for everything.

You do understand the difference between a guide, and a wiki, or just a reference site of some kind, right?

Many games have some kind of fan, or dev, site with lots of good info on how the game works.

I don't care about peoples fotm builds and min/maxing tips.

I don't even know what all the stupid abbreviations mean, I don't know what the different skills are, or what they do.

There is so little info about this game available, because there is so much you can't find what is relevant.

In the beta I randomly fed things to my little floaty dude, and used grinders on stuff I found to (I think) make it better. There is so little info available on HOW THINGS WORK that I couldn't be bothered to stress about what was "best" when it was time consuming enough to figure out how to do stuff.

I never even unlocked a subclass because I had no idea HOW. I knew I had to kill something/someone, I had no information on what they were or where they were. I had no good idea on where to GET that information. I did managed to kill one of the things I needed to, I have no idea when I did it, I looked at the status and saw that one was completed.

One of the good things about the internet is that like minded people can get together and gather information about something they care about, and share it. Sometimes finding such places is not as easy as it might be, but it would be wrong to say that everything is all over the place, sometimes it is compiled in nice logical places... it's like a treasure hunt.

... Watch out for Mimics and other lurking baddies.

know what? what you did is completely normal. that being said surely you noticed when feeding your mag (the little floaty thing) that it TOLD you what feeding it each item was about to do. those windows that pop up.. they usually have information in them that is pertinent, even if 90% of people skip them. did you notice when picking missions that it showed you some of the enemies IN the mission? or that it indicated which missions npcs had quests for you to do?

i digress, theres LOADS of information about this game in particular (spread out all over the place) because it hasnt officially been in english until now. so people did make guides about how to pass the sub-class test, how to get a mag (and feed it), which quests to focus on, etc. IF YOU LOOK. in english though you shouldnt HAVE to look, a properly designed game can tell you everything you need to know about it without ever leaving the game. as for builds.. that should sort of be a learning experience that "bonds" you to your character. if they intended everyone to be using the same build there wouldnt be options outside of that one build. they definitely made it easy enough to add another skill tree to experiment with if you wanted.

theres plenty of information IN the game should you choose to ever feel like reading it, for now though i hope you atleast had fun.

I just google search with "pso2 (thing in question) If I still cant find it, ask in chat or in the arkslayer discord.

But yeah, new players are going to be very lost in this game. I know my mag is so messed up. Will def need a reset after I get enough FUN to do so. And that's after reading ALL of the tool tips. And FYI, they pop up after you've already been doing things for awhile.

The best knowledge I've gotten for this game has been from asking questions with jp players and watching their streams. And some of that info is wildly wrong.

@SamuraiCrazy said in Maining vs. Subbing:

And some of that info is wildly wrong.

well yea, most of it is 5+ years old.

once people get further in they can start using xcubes and photon drops to sort their mags out, its not as bad as it used to be (and frankly having 3 points in a non-optimal stat isnt the end of the world anyways).