Regarding the State of the Localization

@SleeprunnerInc said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

@ApollosAmour The other thread about firing the translators does complete this thread and both are about localization and translations so they go hand in hand and thus can be discussed in both threads.

Its different matter of opinions between me and Leon. Leon likes the translators and want to give them slack. I personally see it differently only because I actually am a manager irl and had seen plenty of crunches to know what consistency and constructive criticism is.

Sure the translators should get slack for the small time they had. But i also feel that they should have done some research before submitting them and proofread them.

I may have sounded harsh on my thread name, but also it clearly shows that the cooperation between SEGA and translator teams made their relations worse as players will start complaining to SEGA and SEGA will just outright never ask this third party company to never partner again. (Maybe. Just 0 rated speculation)

But the other thread exists and it has been quite useful because rhey are fixing them slowly and people are definitely reporting the mistakes.

Both of these threads coexist for their own opinions. I am not gonna say Leon's thread is attacking particularly me, but i am going to be clear about that my opinion still hasn't changed on how translations in this game are extremely still lacking as to JP ones text quality because yes. I am that person who just enjoys reading flavorful text in an mmorpg game. Yes. Unfortunately there are people like me.

I am glad the complaints are being forwarded though. Since its being fixed patch by patch. Even if its slowly.

@LapisWave said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

@SleeprunnerInc said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

@ApollosAmour The other thread about firing the translators does complete this thread and both are about localization and translations so they go hand in hand and thus can be discussed in both threads.

Its different matter of opinions between me and Leon. Leon likes the translators and want to give them slack. I personally see it differently only because I actually am a manager irl and had seen plenty of crunches to know what consistency and constructive criticism is.

Sure the translators should get slack for the small time they had. But i also feel that they should have done some research before submitting them and proofread them.

I may have sounded harsh on my thread name, but also it clearly shows that the cooperation between SEGA and translator teams made their relations worse as players will start complaining to SEGA and SEGA will just outright never ask this third party company to never partner again. (Maybe. Just 0 rated speculation)

But the other thread exists and it has been quite useful because rhey are fixing them slowly and people are definitely reporting the mistakes.

Both of these threads coexist for their own opinions. I am not gonna say Leon's thread is attacking particularly me, but i am going to be clear about that my opinion still hasn't changed on how translations in this game are extremely still lacking as to JP ones text quality because yes. I am that person who just enjoys reading flavorful text in an mmorpg game. Yes. Unfortunately there are people like me.

I am glad the complaints are being forwarded though. Since its being fixed patch by patch. Even if its slowly.

Which is completely fine.

However Sega can't just willy nilly decide to not partner with people based on X things cause well things get in to circulation and soon Sega will be known as a shit company that pays shit wages and BOOM no more translators nor writers nor partners and ultimately sega ends up in the red and bawm.

Things snowballs over time and often it requires just ONE controversy to end even a multi million company.

Not saying this is that specific controversy but rather a piece of the snowball to help it get rolling.

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@SleeprunnerInc That's not what we were talking about. Discussions on the script and the translation process shouldn't be moved elsewhere, it's the content that caused multiple threads to be locked and/or deleted that doesn't belong here. That's what I was saying should be contained to those threads.

@LapisWave As a translator myself, I wonder how many materials they had access to. It seems like the JP team already had English names in mind for many concepts and characters which did carry over, but there were some that didn't (Jig vs Zig for instance). I also wonder how close the teams were in general. It's completely normal to have several translators broken up into teams for a project like this, which explains why some things don't seem to mesh well. But I feel like there should've been a bit more effort in making sure that the scripts aligned in the end.

@ApollosAmour It ain't being moved elsewhere, it's just referenced in correlation with the current thread which is normal.

Regardless of how you might view it, the current state of the localization seems to be ''Fix one thing, mess up another translation or the Re-translation''.

@SleeprunnerInc said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

Things snowballs over time and often it requires just ONE controversy to end even a multi million company.

Any examples of this that don't involve a lawsuit? Ubisoft abused its employees and it's still around...

@SleeprunnerInc I don't think you're reading what I'm saying, so let's drop it.

@Mattwo7 said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

@SleeprunnerInc said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

Things snowballs over time and often it requires just ONE controversy to end even a multi million company.

Any examples of this that don't involve a lawsuit? Ubisoft abused its employees and it's still around...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_corporate_collapses_and_scandals Would this count?

Or would I have to find a specific example?

@ApollosAmour said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

@LapisWave As a translator myself, I wonder how many materials they had access to. It seems like the JP team already had English names in mind for many concepts and characters which did carry over, but there were some that didn't (Jig vs Zig for instance). I also wonder how close the teams were in general. It's completely normal to have several translators broken up into teams for a project like this, which explains why some things don't seem to mesh well. But I feel like there should've been a bit more effort in making sure that the scripts aligned in the end.

You are on the right track there; the South East Asia release actually used bits that Sega of America got completed for the original planned 2013 Western release for PSO2 with further changes like Force --> Wizard being made by AsiaSoft on Sega of Japan's request. That said, if you take the SEA script and swap away all the SEA exclusive terms you get a bit of an idea what the 2013 localization was going to be like. As you brought up, a lot of terminology is indeed decided by Sega of Japan:

  • Campship = Gateship (the current localization altered this into "Gateway Ship")
  • Darker = D-arker
  • Fang Banshee = Fangbanser
  • Forest Exploration = Greenscape Probe
  • Volcanic Cave Exploration = Cauldron Probe
  • Desert Exploration = Lost Sea Probe
  • Tundra Exploration = White Summit Probe
  • Subterranean Tunnels Exploration = Underworks Probe
  • Skyscape Exploration = Skyscape Probe
  • The Ruins Exploration = Ruins Probe

These names are even listed as the English title for the game's Japanese soundtrack. PSO2_Soundtrack.png (as a side note, its also here where the spelling of the EPISODE 4 boss "Train Gidran" is found, so the localizers used SOJ's name for that)

Now with the 2020 localization it appears that, compared to the 2013 localization attempt, not a lot of Sega of Japan's terms and spellings are used with most of the area names remaining intact and (unfortunately). To my knowledge the 2020 translation only uses Sega of Japan's official English names for the following:

  • Character Names (too many to list, i'll name some of the exceptions later).
  • Certain Bosses ("Train Gidran" is SOJ's official English spelling according to the EP 4 Japanese soundtrack).

But yea... it does appear that the localization team did get to have a look at Sega of America's old 2013 localization as reference as quite a lot of terms from their script made it through (terms listed in order JP : SOA : Global):

  • Matter Board = Paradigm Matrix = Divergence Matrix
  • My Room = My Quarters = Personal Quarters
  • Patty = Pati = Pati
  • Tiea = Tia = Tia
  • Enemies = Hostiles = Hostiles
  • Gulf = Galph = Grulf
  • Fangulf = Phongalph = Phongrulf
  • Lilipa Mechs = Automata = Automata
  • Just Attack = Perfect Strike = Perfect Attack (while "Just Attack" is inconsistent with PSU's localization... it is consistent with Phantasy Star Portable 2's localization)

(Regarding Pati and Tia's names... SOA's localization is the correct one here as their names are a play on "Patientia")

Just for fun... here are some of Sega of America's terms which we missed out on (once again, comparison goes in order JP : SOA : Global):

  • Photoners = Lumist = Photoner
  • Free Field = Patrol = Expedition
  • Oodan = Woodan = Udan
  • Aginis = Agnis
  • Digg = Deeg

@SleeprunnerInc said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_corporate_collapses_and_scandals Would this count?

Ah you meant like that. I don't think you realize just how messed up the video game industry as a whole is, Sega would have the upper hand here. If they raised an issue, Sega would ensure they never worked in the industry again.

@Leonkh99 Nice, I didn't know about all of these. I know the guidebooks list a lot of names and they seem a lot more consistent than the earlier PS works. Typically the teams aren't always privy to that sort of info unless the publisher/devs provide it directly. It seems like it might be somewhere in the middle in this case.

@Mattwo7 Oh I know how messed the videogame industry is.

I've watched how EA operated from a semi good company back in early 2000's to the lootbox mongrels of today and how Ubisoft slowly decended in to the allegation company that has constant issues and how RIOT has screwed itself up by growing too big and trying to take the moral highground.

Hell even Steam came crumbling down on itself after trying to make a platform for all games with no quality assurance.

We already had small hints during the simulator era of Steam.

https://mmos.com/news/phantasy-star-online-2-in-north-america-is-segas-1-f2p-title-and-earned-14m-between-april-june

Wow Sega totally is going to shutdown for sure!

/s for the dense.

Seriously people actually think that? You need a reality check if you do.

@SleeprunnerInc said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

Hell even Steam came crumbling down on itself after trying to make a platform for all games with no quality assurance. We already had small hints during the simulator era of Steam.

I mean there were already hints of it with Valve's work ethic in general lol.

@GamerKillance said in Regarding the State of the Localization:

https://mmos.com/news/phantasy-star-online-2-in-north-america-is-segas-1-f2p-title-and-earned-14m-between-april-june Wow Sega totally is going to shutdown for sure! /s for the dense. Seriously people actually think that? You need a reality check if you do.

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