About the sexualization of this and future games.

I'm going a bit general here, so as to include this and newer games. I suppose this won't be a popular opinion in some places because some people seem to love to have this blatant sexualization everywhere so long as the characters objectified are not publicly minors (and some may be closet creeps who wouldn't mind the lower ages as well, nobody knows). But I feel this game went way overboard with this stuff. Been trying to say this since awhile but I couldn't find the words. But now here I am.

Anyway. I cannot name the outfits because I don't have their names, but most know which they are. We also all know about the emotes that get paired with these outfits in lobbies to make the game look disgusting for me and perhaps others. More than reaso why I never stay in a lobby for long. And we also know the female poses for the new Vegas vehicle and Ranger's Rocket Rodeo (which now becomes so blatant thanks to the created PA edit). The outfits alone, while extremely risque, are not the main culprit here (and some swimsuits are ok). The biggest problem to me are the emotes and the poses. Those are the the ones not seen in other games and that turn things into tasteless porny shows when you see several people using them in the lobbies. But both outfits and emotes should be thought out to better reflect the game's setting and lore for any new games.

Yes, I'll get the "It's a Japan game". I'll get the "If you don't like it, leave". But to all of those I say, I'm making this thread to express my opinion for this and for any ideas for future games, to keep what I'm perceiving as already some form of soft core porn to keep rearing it's head in games it's not needed nor called for. We can have plenty of games for adults where those things fit properly without dwindling the quality nor the aesthetic of those games. But here, in a game about space mages with "magic", dragons and fantasy, it's just disgusting to watch and unnecessary to behold. And these things make the lobbies look like seedy bars and adult night clubs.

This doesn't apply to Sega alone, as other companies have made similar things. But at least from my experience, this game has gone well beyond most I've seen out there in this regard. Now, knowing these things will stay in this game, and assuming a group of people (I'll laugh if some of the same ones going against the elimination of the height restriction because it "sexualizes children" come to attack this) will come and either berate me or laugh at me for this. To those, I can only let it known that I do not agree to these additions in these games, and a plea to devs to not create those things for newer projects down the line. I want porn to stay at the hub, not to come to the lobby.

@ZorokiHanuke said in About the sexualization of this and future games.:

I'm going a bit general here, so as to include this and newer games. I suppose this won't be a popular opinion in some places because some people seem to love to have this blatant sexualization everywhere so long as the characters objectified are not publicly minors (and some may be closet creeps who wouldn't mind the lower ages as well, nobody knows). But I feel this game went way overboard with this stuff. Been trying to say this since awhile but I couldn't find the words. But now here I am.

Anyway. I cannot name the outfits because I don't have their names, but most know which they are. We also all know about the emotes that get paired with these outfits in lobbies to make the game look disgusting for me and perhaps others. More than reaso why I never stay in a lobby for long. And we also know the female poses for the new Vegas vehicle and Ranger's Rocket Rodeo (which now becomes so blatant thanks to the created PA edit). The outfits alone, while extremely risque, are not the main culprit here (and some swimsuits are ok). The biggest problem to me are the emotes and the poses. Those are the the ones not seen in other games and that turn things into tasteless porny shows when you see several people using them in the lobbies. But both outfits and emotes should be thought out to better reflect the game's setting and lore for any new games.

Yes, I'll get the "It's a Japan game". I'll get the "If you don't like it, leave". But to all of those I say, I'm making this thread to express my opinion for this and for any ideas for future games, to keep what I'm perceiving as already some form of soft core porn to keep rearing it's head in games it's not needed nor called for. We can have plenty of games for adults where those things fit properly without dwindling the quality nor the aesthetic of those games. But here, in a game about space mages with "magic", dragons and fantasy, it's just disgusting to watch and unnecessary to behold. And these things make the lobbies look like seedy bars and adult night clubs.

This doesn't apply to Sega alone, as other companies have made similar things. But at least from my experience, this game has gone well beyond most I've seen out there in this regard. Now, knowing these things will stay in this game, and assuming a group of people (I'll laugh if some of the same ones going against the elimination of the height restriction because it "sexualizes children" come to attack this) will come and either berate me or laugh at me for this. To those, I can only let it known that I do not agree to these additions in these games, and a plea to devs to not create those things for newer projects down the line. I want porn to stay at the hub, not to come to the lobby.

Why should Japan bow down to hilariously crappy western puritan values? It's their game, they can do what the hell they want with it. "It's a Japan game". I'll get the "If you don't like it, leave" is straight facts though. You don't like the direction this game takes with its content, you are 100% free to ignore it in its entirety, that's up to you.

As for the game being soft core porn....no, once again this is a hilariously dumb take. No one is screwing a character with full on penetration in this game, it's a bunch of ps2 models clipping against one another with banana boats smooshed together. There's zero porn, I don't know what you're seeing but I'm def not seeing "soft core porn" as you put it. People goofing off? Yeah. Porn no.

As for Symbol Arts, you give people freedom to make shit, they're gonna make stupid shit. GMs delete porn symbol arts pretty quickly most of the time but you also have the option of turning that shit off. Hell if you don't wanna see people smooshing banana boats together to get hilariously dumb photo poses you can turn off the models for the lobby in its entirety.

@Lintaur Your opinion is well respected by me, but you disrespect mine as being dumb. Not cool man. Not cool.

@ZorokiHanuke said in About the sexualization of this and future games.:

@Lintaur Your opinion is well respected by me, but you disrespect mine as being dumb. Not cool man. Not cool.

I'm not disrespecting your post at all. Your post is well thought out and I enjoyed reading it. I am however laughing at the porn comments because it's anything but.

@Lintaur That's because I learned long ago there's soft core pn which are dances and posing wearing from skimpy outfits to completely nude, and hard core pn which is what you mentioned. I've had those definitions in my mind since ages. But now I'm not sure if those denominations still exist anymore. Have you ever heard of that?

I haven't been to p**n sites nor around any such media in years (probably more than 10), so maybe things changed?

Edited to not enrage the search engines. 🙂

@ZorokiHanuke

I like your points.

It's not difficult to see the differences between 1 and 2. I don't mind PSO2 (as is) if they altered things further like people suggest in other threads then id be taking more issue.

@Lintaur

It's not that sega jp needs to kowtow to anyone, it's just more so we have an understanding that there is a love for there games here in the west and we like to hold onto our sensibilities in certain regard as the world knows.

Let me recycle an idea I had before. How about a local toggle? You go to options, and the game has a list of outfits and emotes that may be too hot for tv, and with that single toggle your local client replaces the outfits with either the default outfit or a placebo outfit, and the raunchy emotes with the standard dance animation. This way you get a best of both worlds feeling that may welcome those who want to see those things here, and those who don't.

Again, this may be an idea for future games, since i really doubt devs would pull dev time and resources just to please an old gamer about to retire and maybe one or two others. Still, it's good to place your thinking on paper (in this case in a thread). Maybe someone out there would see it and pick on the idea.

Corporations are in it for profit and sex sells. SEGA is making products aimed at mass appeal by including fanservice. You are entitled to your unpopular opinion, but then you might also look into more niche titles.

@ZorokiHanuke said in About the sexualization of this and future games.:

Let me recycle an idea I had before. How about a local toggle? You go to options, and the game has a list of outfits and emotes that may be too hot for tv, and with that single toggle your local client replaces the outfits with either the default outfit or a placebo outfit, and the raunchy emotes with the standard dance animation. This way you get a best of both worlds feeling that may welcome those who want to see those things here, and those who don't.

Again, this may be an idea for future games, since i really doubt devs would pull dev time and resources just to please an old gamer about to retire and maybe one or two others. Still, it's good to place your thinking on paper (in this case in a thread). Maybe someone out there would see it and pick on the idea.

WE CAN'T HAVE REASONABLE THOUGHTS ON THIS FORUM ZORO!! ARE YOU INSANE?! GIVING PEOPLE THE......THE OPTION TO CHOOSE THINGS?! I...I can't believe what I'm reading, how...how dare you spew such hearsay on these forums!

This is how I always wish things go. Give people the option to choose.

@Lintaur said in About the sexualization of this and future games.:

@ZorokiHanuke said in About the sexualization of this and future games.:

Let me recycle an idea I had before. How about a local toggle? You go to options, and the game has a list of outfits and emotes that may be too hot for tv, and with that single toggle your local client replaces the outfits with either the default outfit or a placebo outfit, and the raunchy emotes with the standard dance animation. This way you get a best of both worlds feeling that may welcome those who want to see those things here, and those who don't.

Again, this may be an idea for future games, since i really doubt devs would pull dev time and resources just to please an old gamer about to retire and maybe one or two others. Still, it's good to place your thinking on paper (in this case in a thread). Maybe someone out there would see it and pick on the idea.

WE CAN'T HAVE REASONABLE THOUGHTS ON THIS FORUM ZORO!! ARE YOU INSANE?! GIVING PEOPLE THE......THE OPTION TO CHOOSE THINGS?! I...I can't believe what I'm reading, how...how dare you spew such hearsay on these forums!

This is how I always wish things go. Give people the option to choose.

Yeah, how dare I. 🙂

But really, I picked this idea from what I saw in a game called Kritika. No, they don't do exactly what I mentioned. But they have a toggle called "simplify avatars" which makes every avatar not the player remove all bling accessories and all outfits and replaces them with the default looks of said characters. It's actually a neat way to reduce load on less powerful PCs, but I thought it could also be used as a ways of locally censor content without shoving said censor down the throats of those who don't want it.

Seems like a waste of time for anything between little benefit to detriment, West still isn't so far brainwashed as universally accepting censorship as a positive thing. The time used up in censoring, voluntary or not, could be used for betterment of the product. Fixing bugs, communicating with playerbase, adding more cosmetics, removing regionlocks from countries of the """global""" release, holding events, just about anything I can think of would be better than trying to appease 0.1% Karens playing your game, an exercise in futility since Karens always will find something to complain about.

@ZorokiHanuke So I had read your post. First up, i'll commend you for your well thoughout statements though I would not go as far as blaming Sega for the actions of players abusing what they are given for these sort of things. I wanna give my own perspective on whats going on though as someone who tries to research the franchise and Sega of Japan's general direction with things.

Now... a lot of what you said would be a lot different if Sega were a Western company and the game was made with a Global audience in mind. Truth of the matter though is that Sega is a Japanese company and ultimately they had yet to make the shift towards a global outlook the way Capcom have. Sega of Japan's ultimately mentality is to prioritize the domestic Japanese market and if it has potential to appeal to the West... they'll export it. This has worked for some franchises like the Ryu ga Gotoku / Yakuza franchise but has drawn the ire of fans of other franchises.

Phantasy Star Online has a huge divide between what it is that Japanese players want and what Western players want. The first Phantasy Star Online was developed with an ambitious global outlook and, aside from the occasional Classic Series fan complaining about the story or action RPG gameplay or even the departure from the anime art style, it generally ended up having the sort of appeal. However what gets overlooked a lot is just how much of a bigger deal the game was in Japan as Online games of the scale of PSO1 were not that well known as a result of them usually being more of a PC thing... in a region where PC gaming wasn't all that popular and where ISPs charged per-minute. Phantasy Star Online introduced the Japanese market to online gaming in a form that was accessible.

Phantasy Star Universe had a lot of design decisions based on the Japanese market mainly though to the surprise of some people here the game didn't become that huge until the end of its lifespan... when elements that would pave the way for Phantasy Star Online 2 began to take root (the game did sell well on initial launch... but this never tranlated to active subscribers). Phantasy Star Universe became free-to-play and brought with it the Guardians Cash (GC) currency, Phantasy Star Portable 2 got a lot of attention thanks to its collaborations with popular things like other franchises and even other media (you could get posters for your room featuring real life Bikini models) as well as the large amount of cosmetic options which were exported back to Phantasy Star Universe. Dressing up your character and interacting with others online became one of the main appeals of this franchise to the Japanese market.

Now thing with Phantasy Star in the West is that none of these other games took off the way Phantasy Star Online did. While Sega's mismanagement had a hand in it, a lot is ultimately down to the "Not MY Phantasy Star Online" problem... many HATED the direction that Phantasy Star Universe took with its gameplay and story and many couldn't wrap their head why would Sega release a new Phantasy Star game on the PSP, when the answer is all right there... Sega is a Japanese company, Phantasy Star is a Japanese franchise, Sega has repeatedly shown that, aside from Sonic, they will not stand a franchise that ONLY appeals to what Western fans want.

So here we are... the many things that are being criticized in this very post.... its a little too late for that. PSO2 right now has defined the franchise's identity moving forward; the gameplay will continue to be the fast-paced over the top action, collaborations and costumes which push the envelope will contnue to be a thing, etc. We've all kind of accepted that this is a Japanese franchise and while Sega may go out of their way to do things that appeal to the global market, these will be things that also don't compromise on their 'main' market. The timing of your post couldn't be worse as recently, there's been outcry over Western demand for Japanese content to be censored... if Sega were to actually see this and take action in future games, the outcry from their main market (as well as new players introduced through PSO2) would be quite large and fingers will be pointed at Western fans.

@havox4

Nobody is saying censorship left and right at every angle on everything in the world is a good thing, we're just understandably trying to protect one of the more important things that we care to revolving youth and our perception of their treatment in a public manor.

This is the one area of censorship I feel is always appropriated, and the ONE area I feel I can take pride in its use. I don't know why you're so adamant. Maybe you just don't care as to what others would care for beyond yourself.

@Leonkh99

Regarding your last paragraph, I'll gladly take the blame... send the hate mail to me... I bleed for you phantasy star! haha.

What youth, PSO2 NA since ep4 is now M-rated.

I do think the sexual aspects should be removed.