@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

@Miraglyth pole dance was at 13million on ship 2 the day of PC launch, so any PC whale had instant access to their initial investment fund.

Very few items exceeded 20m in price prior to the PC launch, so if the Xbox Mafia was going to accelerate the price increase of all the items, why was it not done prior to PC release? Dance 20 wasn't even that high before and it was already off the obtainable scratches.

Now that ship transfers are a thing, paired with how easy it is to make 10-20 million meseta just from questing, it will be even easier for whales to increase their in-game meseta in exchange for real life money. RMT at it's finest.

While I can agree some changes need to be made, I don't want the ability to capitalize off individual's FOMO mentality to be gone completely. I have been saving some items for a very long time to get the most bang for my buck.

Nice try xbox mafia.

@Shirokami07 multiplatform mafia.

Limiting yourself to one device is limiting your potential, young Palawan!

Seriously though, there are at least two konosuba items that are pretty low price that will explode due to the market control at the end of July. Make the problem work for you.

@Shirokami07 said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

@Miraglyth pole dance was at 13million on ship 2 the day of PC launch, so any PC whale had instant access to their initial investment fund.

Very few items exceeded 20m in price prior to the PC launch, so if the Xbox Mafia was going to accelerate the price increase of all the items, why was it not done prior to PC release? Dance 20 wasn't even that high before and it was already off the obtainable scratches.

Now that ship transfers are a thing, paired with how easy it is to make 10-20 million meseta just from questing, it will be even easier for whales to increase their in-game meseta in exchange for real life money. RMT at it's finest.

While I can agree some changes need to be made, I don't want the ability to capitalize off individual's FOMO mentality to be gone completely. I have been saving some items for a very long time to get the most bang for my buck.

Nice try xbox mafia.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

@Shirokami07 multiplatform mafia.

Limiting yourself to one device is limiting your potential, young Palawan!

Seriously though, there are at least two konosuba items that are pretty low price that will explode due to the market control at the end of July. Make the problem work for you.

You mean to say there's a way to get infinite meseta and ac like some xbox players did?

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

@Miraglyth pole dance was at 13million on ship 2 the day of PC launch, so any PC whale had instant access to their initial investment fund.

Pole Dance was from the Career Line scratch that ended a week after PC launch. Scratch content normally starts curving up in price when its supply is coming to an end as lazy speculators get involved.

You have concluded that heavy AC spending PC players quickly sold their initial AC scratch pulls while they were still available (which itself is not optimal moneymaking) to... what, take advantage of Xbox players being blind about Pole Dance's value for the 3 weeks they were able to get it first?

Let me present you with three obvious explanations: First, that some of the fastest PC players to hit that 13 million bought Pole Dance to use it, which is a simple increase in demand that naturally raises prices. Second, that because demand rocketed due to the influx of new players, the Xbox players who had almost all the money on the server belatedly realised the growth potential of Pole Dance and then started hoarding it. Three, that because the emote was disappearing soon anyway, its price began rising as all imminently-departing AC scratch content does.

I confess to amazement at your conclusion on this one.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

Very few items exceeded 20m in price prior to the PC launch

See above; big influx in players, demand soaring for content whose supply had already been terminated. PC players' general role in that was as increased demand, not new hoarders. In any case I can name a few items on Ship 3 that were 20+ million and a few others that went extinct in player shops prior to PC launch, so... yeah.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

so if the Xbox Mafia was going to accelerate the price increase of all the items, why was it not done prior to PC release?

You do remember mid-May... right? Most of the Xbox players on the forums and social media were saying that the PC players were a vocal minority whining about launch dates, whose arrival wouldn't have a noticeable impact on the server population. A slim number thought PC players would outnumber Xbox ones. Nobody - nobody - anticipated the surge in arrivals that saw the server soar from maybe a dozen full blocks to over 400 for a few days.

Heck, don't you remember what you were saying in the run-up to PC release? Here:

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Severe underestimation of the immense amount of players joining Ship 02:

Metrics that would be used to make a decision to increase server capacity doesn't support the few that think there will be a massive influx of players that will overwhelm the current system.

I hope that there will be that many players joining, but there definitely aren't that many who have made their intentions to play the NA version known.

So if you're going to act like Xbox players had foresight and that PC release wasn't a massive wake-up call to people who only subsequently opened their eyes to the potential of reselling, I am just going to laugh at you.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

While I can agree some changes need to be made, I don't want the ability to capitalize off individual's FOMO mentality to be gone completely. I have been saving some items for a very long time to get the most bang for my buck.

That's fair. There's no point (or even education value) to an in-game economy if you sterilise it so much that it can't demonstrate any economic principles.

I just feel there needs to be more discouragement of hoarding and uncontrolled reselling, partly to mitigate the clear impact of giving one portion of the playerbase a crazy resource headstart and additional cash injections on top, but mostly to help more of the content end up in the hands of more people who actually want to use it instead of being a damned investment for meseta billionaires while dozens of players seethe at being priced out of being able to put it to its intended use.

@Shirokami07 speaking frankly, any exploit that happens on Xbox involves a PC to facilitate it.

The exploit involved tickets, not AC itself, and it was stated that the surplus tickets were removed while the system was suspended, so come up with a better argument.

@Miraglyth if you are an AC whale, why would you not start off the game with 13m so that you can start purchasing items that will increase exponentially in price?

Regardless of the surge of players, if the "Xbox mafia" was going to purchase all the cheaper items, why would they not have done it while the items were significantly cheaper and wait until after they have already doubled in price?

The narrative of this thread is that Xbox players had unlimited AC tickets and meseta, so why would they have not immediately purchased everything instead of waiting until after PC release? If people were shocked by the temporary population boom, they probably aren't the ones controlling the market, cause it is pretty obvious that adding a more accessible platform to a game is going to lead to an influx of players.

The point of this all is that there is nothing inaccessible from an AC whale regardless of platform. Even if they don't whale through scratches, 12 characters completing weeklies and dailies is well over 20m a week just from client orders/weeklies. The game lacks any real "goldsinks" at the moment other than playershops, so any solution impacting playershops would also have to be balanced by severely reducing the amount of meseta that can be earned until augmenting is being forced down rveryone's throats.

Even then, the mafia would just move on to controlling the fodder prices, so there is no way to win without introducing a system that makes players spend all their meseta.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

@Miraglyth if you are an AC whale, why would you not start off the game with 13m so that you can start purchasing items that will increase exponentially in price?

Because if you are a 100% new player on day one who doesn't even know if the game is fun to play yet, you are probably also unlocking Volcano Exploration on the level 4 Hunter you aren't sure will be your long-term main class while wondering how you got to the mission pass menu you saw once earlier and subsequently lost. This idea that a new person is both fully used to the game and has the benefit of two months of experience of the state of the game's economy is bemusing to say the least.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

Regardless of the surge of players, if the "Xbox mafia" was going to purchase all the cheaper items, why would they not have done it while the items were significantly cheaper and wait until after they have already doubled in price?

This is vague. Significantly cheaper than when? Doubled from what? In any case I already described lazy speculators. Some hoarders do join in a price escalation after it starts, either because they noticed it late or because they were offline at the time. Because after all if the price is still steadily rising it's never a bad time.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

The narrative of this thread is that Xbox players had unlimited AC tickets and meseta, so why would they have not immediately purchased everything instead of waiting until after PC release?

For starters unlimited is an exaggeration, especially for anyone who remembers the cheating that meant it was essentially unlimited in Universe. For seconders, I already answered this last post; almost nobody expected any PC influx, let alone the scale of it.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

If people were shocked by the temporary population boom, they probably aren't the ones controlling the market

...

Please consider this for a moment. You are asserting that when someone with a lot of meseta sees an ongoing spike in demand they think "I could buy these now and be guaranteed to sell them for more later, but since I didn't know they would rise in the first place I will ignore that free money. Oh well!"

I'd just like you to think about that.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

cause it is pretty obvious that adding a more accessible platform to a game is going to lead to an influx of players.

You probably started replying to my last message before I found and edited in a quote from you the day before PC release saying there wouldn't be a massive influx. The late edit is on me.

But this little act of retelling history should be a lesson to all in hindsight and how people forget they thought differently prior to having it. As promised in my previous post, I am now laughing at you.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

The game lacks any real "goldsinks" at the moment other than playershops, so any solution impacting playershops would also have to be balanced by severely reducing the amount of meseta that can be earned until augmenting is being forced down rveryone's throats.

I'm disregarding your talk about AC whales getting what they want because not all of them will be interested in spoiling others' fun for the profit they largely don't need to make at that point.

Ideas I've suggested in previous topics are things like scaling the player shop tax to being more than 5% to discourage reselling higher-value items. It's easy to buy something for 40 million and sell it for 50 million with a 5% shop cut (~47.6m). If the shop cut scaled up to 15%+ that high the margin would be slashed enough to make it not worth it, and the eventual buyer is more likely to be someone who actually wants to use it. Yes a reseller could still trade with the first seller to swerve the cut but it would be impractical to horde like this (and also clue in the first seller to raise their price). This would also serve as a meseta sink.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

Even then, the mafia would just move on to controlling the fodder prices, so there is no way to win without introducing a system that makes players spend all their meseta.

By fodder you mean things like 10-12 star weapons to serve as grind fodder or augment factors? If so, let them! Unlike concluded campaigns and scratch sets players can generate those themselves at any time, and the most they'll miss out on is an upgrade to a weapon that'll be obsoleted within a couple months anyway. This would be a huge improvement to the status quo.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

The exploit involved tickets, not AC itself, and it was stated that the surplus tickets were removed while the system was suspended, so come up with a better argument.

Brave to say that when you have people around in reddit claiming otherwise and that that's how they got rich.

@Miraglyth sorry, didn't realize that the massive wake up call led to ships 4-6 being opened rather than making more "instances" on the same servers already runnin--- oh wait.

The game hit "full" on the first day (ps is did that on Xbox as well, ahemahem), was crowded for maybe a week? (did that on xbox as well), and is now never crowded or anything?

Sounds like the boom was overhyped.

Besides, you keep manipulating the focus of our discussion to try and prove your dying points, so we can agree that you will keep complaining and the rest of the players will move on with their lives.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

@Miraglyth if you are an AC whale, why would you not start off the game with 13m so that you can start purchasing items that will increase exponentially in price?

Can confirm. While I don't hoard items, I would be considered a whale and had around 15m on day 1. I can also say that if Sega ever implemented a restriction on me being able to sell my AC items, I would spend way less money on the game. They need to be careful they don't chase away the whales or they game has no financial support.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

@Miraglyth sorry, didn't realize that the massive wake up call led to ships 4-6 being opened rather than making more "instances" on the same servers already runnin--- oh wait.

The game hit "full" on the first day (ps is did that on Xbox as well, ahemahem)

It's almost like you're trying to draw me away from the merit of the discussion into off-topic pedantry. Xbox filled ship 1 on the first day so ship 2 got added. It never filled ship 3 on the release of open beta (after a month of downtime) or "launch". As far as anyone knew by that point, a ship was 60 blocks. If they hadn't pulled the extra 78 blocks per ship out of nowhere on that day the PC influx was enough to need at least seven ships.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

Besides, you keep manipulating the focus of our discussion to try and prove your dying points

This after the previous quote, and after the entirety of my last post was very much about the economy...

@Lorient said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

I can also say that if Sega ever implemented a restriction on me being able to sell my AC items, I would spend way less money on the game. They need to be careful they don't chase away the whales or they game has no financial support.

That's why another of my ideas was to shop-lock an item that's been brought through the player shop for a period of time. The original seller would be completely unaffected by that.

Another idea I had while writing the previous post was to have each item require a greater cut to sell on the player shop for each time it had already sold on the player shop. This would be a direct nerf to reselling while leaving the person who drew it in the scratch ticket completely unaffected as well.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Beware of the Xbox mafia!:

Now that ship transfers are a thing, paired with how easy it is to make 10-20 million meseta just from questing, it will be even easier for whales to increase their in-game meseta in exchange for real life money. RMT at it's finest.

Honestly, you make it sound like people can just hop from ship to ship willy nilly. We don't even know if they're going to keep the service around and even if they did, it still requires us to wait for the next maintenance. They knew people would exploit it so they made it harder to exploit.

Kinda wondering if every ship got people like this: reading things such as "just because pc kids cry sega is rereleasing old stuff....i will soon loose alot of money just because they will probably rerelease other stuff in future"

So people are being "sad" that they cannot sell various "xbox only" items to pc player for 70m meseta and above (ya ive seen fashion going for 70m+) and their highest concern is that old scratch ticket items may be rereleased as well...i mean ok

@Miraglyth if you somehow think that quoting me on a debate about opening more servers for PC launch is relevant to me stating that already existing servers would have a significant increase in players to sell AC items to is on topic, well.. I don't know what to say. You laugh at me for the servers very temporarily filling up, yet I laugh at ship 4 remaining close and the servers never reaching "crowded", which thoroughly defeated your initial argument about how additional ships were a must.

You quoting me on something off-topic destroys your validity in any logical discussions moving forward. That will save me from future walls of text.

@Mattwo7 there are plenty of people (ironically pc players) who expressed they are going to buy items from less inflated servers and transfer them over to their hyper-inflated economy afterwards.

Not sure why you think that they would bring a service for a very brief period of time and then take it away, when it has persisted in JP for a very long time. They are getting ready to open more ships, so they won't be terminating that service any time soon.