What Are CAST? (possible Spoilers)

@ZorokiHanuke Being made of materials we deem non alive is more or less the point of being not alive.

Machine's can be ''alive'' (Working independently, moving on it's own or acting like it's alive) but they are not ''ALIVE'' in the sense of humans, trees, animals etc are.

Don't bring religion in to this cause that's just plain asking for a fight even if you don't mean it.

A machine is programmed to do certain tasks which they perform cause of their programming parameters.

And long as they have that part in them, they are not truly ''alive''.

However were they to have a human, animal, alien sentient life form injected in to them, then they would very much be alive and a living organism but not a new one.

They would be an extension of the old lifeform which is inhabiting the body or vice versa.

A good argument for CASTS would be Nanomachines or any kind of living organism that renews, creates indendepently new things on the CAST to grow much like any life form we have accepted.

So honestly, CASTs are a lifeform since they have a humanoid sentient organism inside of them and are not purely machines.

The line is drawn between: Created pure machines VS Sentient living organism machines (Transplanted human in to machine)

@SleeprunnerInc What I'm trying to explain is the difference between life and sentience. There's no doubt that what is not alive, is simply not alive. Machines themselves are not alive, even if they move. I mean, The Earth has things that move, yet they are not alive. Like lava coming out of volcanoes and the whole magnetic stuff. That's what I claim as "emulating life". Since living things usually move, or show signs of said life in other ways (like growth). So yes, the machine part of a cast is not alive at all. But if they do have live human tissue (Brain at least because that's where human thoughts come from), then they are persons. Humans. There would be no denying that either. At least in my humble opinion.

As for sentience, a different thing from life, Humans have deemed themselves the only sentient beings in the world (and so far the only proven ones in the known universe), just because their thought process is way superior to that perceived (by us) from animals and plants and other living beings. From our sentience we started thinking about things beyond what we see physically, and that brings us to religion and souls/spirits, which is why I brought it into the topic. (and in no way am I looking for a fight here, which is why I talk respectfully about it and ONLY to tie it into the topic of this franchise's lore, since the Universe series did have a religion).

And this then brings me to my initial question. Does a full machine, one we know is not alive, with no biological tissue at all, has the right to claim sentience and a soul because it has finally and completely emulated the self thought process of a human being? Or do they still fall into a human copy denomination simply because there's no actual life in them? Some people say one thing, some say another. I simply keep the question because I don't feel myself intelligent enough to delve into it.

@ZorokiHanuke If it's a pure machine with no living tissues or any living organism then no, it is not a person nor human being, it is a MACHINE.

However in the world of PSO, they have a widely different grasp on humanity, rules etc which is why it makes sense in their world to classify this as that.

If it was a machine wtih a human brain and capable of emitting human though process or any other known sentient beings thought process then yes it would be deemed as a person if it is capable of acting on it's own and surviving on it's own.

If it was for example working like an ant which is a hive mind then you would classify them as a drone.

They would be ''sentient beings'' but not humanoids in anyway shape or form.

@SleeprunnerInc I do agree to that. In the Universe series, where I did not see any lore pertaining to machines having any biological mass inside, Casts went to war with humans because they realized themselves as persons. Not living beings, not humans, but as persons. Or at least sentient beings on equal footing to the biological races. Of course the rules may be different here in the real world, but that's how it all supposedly happened on Universe.

CASTs in classic and PSO were called "androids" (PSO used "CAST" in the class/race combo designations though) but I have absolutely no idea how biological they are.

In PSU they are undoutably androids, including the "cast clones" like Magashi as those are closer to brain-scan AI from Halo like Cortana and the Alpha AI from Red vs Blue. PSU CASTs have varying levels of autonomy, cognitive capacity and emotional capacity, depending on how they're made. (It's also possible that some modify themselves like how Perceptor in Transformers Animated removed his capacity to have tones of voice (in other words, he's "voiced" by a TTS) to focus his processing power on knowledge)

The CASTS in PSO2 are basically like alchemic homunculi (or Cybermen with emotions) and unless I am mistaken High-Casts are something similar to what Xiao is? I'm really not so sure about that one...

@ZorokiHanuke Far as I know, there is no singular definition for CASTS or what they are.

In PSO2 they are organical robots in the sense that they contain the person's brain inside of them.

In PSU they could literally be just machines with ego's based on simulations or data gathered on other human beings.

Of course then we got the alternative reality mumbojumbo.

@SleeprunnerInc It is sad that the lore is so strikingly different throughout the franchise. Heck, check the defnition of Casts in Portable 2. It's different from Universe's. I mean, You do remember the denomination given to the mag-like machines inhabiting the player's room? They are called "Synths". They can transform into mini people (the bodies were limited to some 3 or so girl types, a shota boy type, and some animal types if I remember). Portable 2 brings us this description.

"CASTs are one of the four races of the Phantasy Star universe. Evolved from synths, and the main structure that formed a copy-cast."

....evolved from synths? Now that's an even further addition to the lore mess. Now, I understand that from PSO1 to PSO2, that casts could be changed from pure machines, into what we consider cyborgs. But the definition given in Universe, and then the one given in Portable 2, which shares lore location (and a bunch of main characters) with Universe? Talk about creating plot holes...

@ZorokiHanuke said in What Are CAST? (possible Spoilers):

You do remember the denomination given to the mag-like machines inhabiting the player's room? They are called "Synths". They can transform into mini people (the bodies were limited to some 3 or so girl types, a shota boy type, and some animal types if I remember). Portable 2 brings us this description.

Those were the same thing as fully evolved Partner Machines too.

@ZorokiHanuke said in What Are CAST? (possible Spoilers):

"CASTs are one of the four races of the Phantasy Star universe. Evolved from synths, and the main structure that formed a copy-cast." ....evolved from synths?

There's more than one definition of "evolved" you know. Technology "evolves". Also I'm pretty sure "synth" means the robots in PSU lore in general aside from the CASTs. MySynths are non-cognitive robot servants just like how all the other non-CAST robots are mindless machines. And when I say non-CAST I'm pretty sure that includes Mother Brain? Not sure of the details about her to be honest. It's been far too long.

@ZorokiHanuke That "evolved" to me sounds like it means that synths were the technological precursor to CASTs, ie. advancements and refinements in the technology that created synths eventually lead to the creation of CASTs.

@Mattwo7 @AndrlCh Yeah. I know that "evolve' here doesn't mean the kind of evolution proposed by Darwin. So that's not what strikes me. What does strike me was that they added the bit about synths being pretty much the base for casts in the final game of the series. It's like they just thought that out last or something.

@ZorokiHanuke I don't see the problem here? Synths were robots that were eventually developed into CASTs as technology advanced. Makes perfect sense to me. It makes about as much sense as the immediate predecessor to Gundams, Guncannons being developed from tanks that got progressively more humanoid with RTX-44s and Guntanks.

I already mentioned that I recall literally every other robot in PSU lore are synths, not just MySynths.

@Mattwo7 said in What Are CAST? (possible Spoilers):

@ZorokiHanuke I don't see the problem here? Synths were robots that were eventually developed into CASTs as technology advanced. Makes perfect sense to me. It makes about as much sense as the immediate predecessor to Gundams, Guncannons being developed from tanks that got progressively more humanoid with RTX-44s and Guntanks.

It's not the bit of info itself, but the way I found about it. These games have plenty of NPCs, so I'd need to know if any of them mentioned it. I remember interacting with them all between missions as they changed their messages. Yet I don't remember getting this info from any of the games (I DO have memory problems, so maybe I just forgot, so I'll need correction if need be). So of course, that was a bit of a hit for me. I mean, imagine if in Star Wars, Darth Vader never told Luke [that certain thing he said in episode 5] in any of the movies, and then George Lucas placed that info in some behind the scenes book made after Revenge of the Sith. That's more or less the kind of feeling I had when I read that.

Edited in case someone haven't yet seen those movies.....

@ZorokiHanuke That was important to the plot, not just the worldbuilding, there's a pretty massive difference there.

@Mattwo7 Again, that's how I, me, myself, felt. Regardless of what was important or not. This was a "me" thing.

@ZorokiHanuke Wait, you're not the one who added that to the wiki are you?