Removing Height Restrictions

In other words- "I'm just a GM here to make sure no one is an a-hole asking to get banned" - like we understood. It's strange to even have a suggestions thread when no actual developer has ever spoken to the community. We get PR from pso2 twitter and GMs in the forums- but nothing beyond the scope of the underlings there to keep things pacified and calm the riots.

There needs to be a bigger figure that can be a spokesperson- we don't even know who really is in charge of this localization. It's so secretive in a way. Or maybe it's just so botched no one wants to come forth with their name that is actually on the team.

@MoldyAsp33874 said in Removing Height Restrictions:

In other words- "I'm just a GM here to make sure no one is an a-hole asking to get banned" - like we understood. It's strange to even have a suggestions thread when no actual developer has ever spoken to the community. We get PR from pso2 twitter and GMs in the forums- but nothing beyond the scope of the underlings there to keep things pacified and calm the riots.

There needs to be a bigger figure that can be a spokesperson- we don't even know who really is in charge of this localization. It's so secretive in a way. Or maybe it's just so botched no one wants to come forth with their name that is actually on the team.

I wanna start by saying I really do think think this should be addressed and that there are many reasons why it should be reverted to how it is in JP. However, in fairness here, we're a literal foreign entity they've had to deal with during a time in which a lot of their normal work is drastically changed from the norm. JP PSO2 is getting very barebones updates at the moment and what we're getting on NA was clearly planned pretty far in advance.

It's clear between the GMs and the guys running the social media portion that there are a lot of people behind this project that want it to succeed stateside, but this can't be an easy situation for anyone involved and rapid responses aren't something that's going to be super simple right now I imagine. Despite that, they have actually gone and responded pretty directly to a good few things already such as removing the constant SG "sales" and fixing a lot of the big reported bugs, even some of the more minor ones such as weekly ta rankings. All in all, it's clear they're paying attention and trying to get things done, but some things definitely take priority and I imagine this isn't at the top of that list with things like the MS Store issues not to mention the global pandemic of all things to consider.

Also, as someone who works in software dev, I can tell you right now that if Sega has been facing anything close to what I've been seeing, it's likely been quite tough on them in general lately due to forced remote working due to infrastructure reasons. All the more so with a system in a foreign country that was never live prior to the virus and the random problems of launching an MMO altogether.

@MoldyAsp33874 said in Removing Height Restrictions:

Lets not even bring this up. This will just lead to even more stupid changes if people start complaining about shapes. Shapes happen everywhere- it doesn't mean anything.

I said it before, I mostly care about the double standards. This raises a lot of issues related to double standards.

I mean it says a lot about a lack of conviction and dedication to this project, how Sega's willing to censor one aspect of a game but not go whole horse on the censorship. You can only ever have it one way or another. You just wind up pissing off EVERYONE who cares so much about these issues otherwise. Is it not better to appeal to the majority of people who actually play your game? The majority of people who actually going to have interest in the game? Also, they shouldn't be pretending to support BLM, they don't actually care.

Who are they even trying to appease by censoring this single aspect of the game? It sure as hell isn't any ratings boards. It sure as hell isn't the "PC brigade" as some people put it.

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@Mattwo7 im pretty sure most people playing don't care about the censorship. Either that or its not that big of a deal to them. How can you say they aren't dedicated to the project because of height censoring? That's a bit over blown is it not? Im also wondering what their supposed blm support has to do with this

@XenoBladeX37645 There is definitely a large portion of players that probably don't even know its censored and that's fine. There's also a lot of people that don't care when censorship happens as you said. I'll never understand that but whatever, you do you as they say.

What's obvious about all this though is you were NEVER going to hear the phrase "they better censor it for NA or I'll be upset, not play, not spend money on it, etc. So why the change when it's obvious the pointless censorship was going to cause issues?

Everyone here is still just waiting for an excuse that's remotely acceptable at the very least, because the chances of them coming to their senses and realizing, "yeah this was a dumb idea, or bad", is slim to none.

This change hasn't been positive in any sense of the word. It didn't get the rating lessened, it doesn't make them look better for doing it, it didn't make more people play the game, and it didn't make more players spend more money.

I'm on the same boat as "please just let me import my character data already." It's so silly and stupid of a change. It never needed to happen for any real reason.

Well, if I had to guess, it would be the same reason Tera Online censored the outfits of the North American releases outfits of the Elin. Many on the outside looking in, that aren't gamers, who aren't into Anime, or who wouldn't know that players just want ridiculously short or tall characters, would potentially see the option of short, anime looking characters in revealing outfits, as lolicon, as the very revealing and skimpy outfit options this game has, would be guaranteed to cause some self righteous politician to try and have the game shut down,or heavily censored, had we been given these options.

While most normal people wouldn't react in such a way, we live in a society where cancel culture is paramount to many political parties, and the very systems they wish to enact upon the opposing party here in the West. Democratic and Republican leaders/activist movements, are both equally guilty of this flaw, as both wish to censor and control some aspect of someone else's life.

Look to how certain laws have in the past, been used in broad strokes to act as an excuse for censorship in the general sense. Too much government is just as bad as too little, yet nobody has found the balance. This height censorship is no exception, and it's a moment where the company has taken the proactive step to pre-censor, within reason, as to prevent possible legal issues, at least in my opinion. The only other logical option would be outfit censorship, and that's far worse than a foot or a few centimeters of height difference in my opinion.

I say be happy with what you got, because in all honesty, the height difference is barely noticeable, and offers the company some leeway in the future if laws pass in the future, that are even more restrictive. At least that's how I see this move by SEGA. It's a very smart move, given the world we find ourselves in, a world where even the most innocent of spoken words can be seen as offensive somehow. A world over sensitive to differences of opinion, where hate of said difference runs rampant. Perhaps in time, the company will lift the restrictions in better times, but it probably wouldn't be any time soon.

@Anarchy-Marine said in Removing Height Restrictions:

Well, if I had to guess, it would be the same reason Tera Online censored the outfits of the North American releases outfits of the Elin. Many on the outside looking in, that aren't gamers, who aren't into Anime, or who wouldn't know that players just want ridiculously short or tall characters, would potentially see the option of short, anime looking characters in revealing outfits, as lolicon, as the very revealing and skimpy outfit options this game has, would be guaranteed to cause some self righteous politician to try and have the game shut down,or heavily censored, had we been given these options.

While most normal people wouldn't react in such a way, we live in a society where cancel culture is paramount to many political parties, and the very systems they wish to enact upon the opposing party here in the West. Democratic and Republican leaders/activist movements, are both equally guilty of this flaw, as both wish to censor and control some aspect of someone else's life.

Look to how certain laws have in the past, been used in broad strokes to act as an excuse for censorship in the general sense. Too much government is just as bad as too little, yet nobody has found the balance. This height censorship is no exception, and it's a moment where the company has taken the proactive step to pre-censor, within reason, as to prevent possible legal issues, at least in my opinion. The only other logical option would be outfit censorship, and that's far worse than a foot or a few centimeters of height difference in my opinion.

I say be happy with what you got, because in all honesty, the height difference is barely noticeable, and offers the company some leeway in the future if laws pass in the future, that are even more restrictive. At least that's how I see this move by SEGA. It's a very smart move, given the world we find ourselves in, a world where even the most innocent of spoken words can be seen as offensive somehow. A world over sensitive to differences of opinion, where hate of said difference runs rampant. Perhaps in time, the company will lift the restrictions in better times, but it probably wouldn't be any time soon.

NAH BnS and FFXIV says otherwise, they are doing short characters just fine.

@Alineah in FFXIV everyone knows lalas are pure evil. but everyone also accepts their existance.

@Anarchy-Marine said in Removing Height Restrictions:

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@Shadowth117 said in Removing Height Restrictions:

For reference:

Ingame min height JP: 139 cm, 4ft 6.7 inches

Auxiliary min height JP: 84 cm, 2ft 0.07 inches

Ingame min height NA: 153 cm, 5ft 0.2 inches

Auxiliary min height NA: 91 cm, 2ft 11.83 inches

US 10th percentile height: 152.502 cm, 5ft 0.04 inches

US 1st percentile height: 144.399, 4ft 8.85 inches

US 2015-2016 height data breakdown: https://dqydj.com/height-percentile-calculator-for-men-and-women/

US 2015-2016 height data source: https://wwwn.cdc.gov/nchs/nhanes/continuousnhanes/default.aspx?BeginYear=2015

As shown in the above data, literally 1 in 10 women in the US fall below the NA PSO2 minimum height. That's actually silly. They may be short, but let's think about that. The population of women in the United States is estimated to be around 169 million right now based on here: https://countrymeters.info/en/United_States_of_America_(USA) (data source linked on that site).

This means that almost 17 million people, not even counting the male side, would not be able to make their character their real height for reasons that did not exist in the original version of the game. That's just ridiculous, honestly.

all we need is for one of those 17 million short women to be rich and pay some lawyers to force them to lift the censorship.

@Anarchy-Marine No. You can't just say to accept it- there's no use justifying it. There isn't any single way to justify it. It is not a change due to laws- or ratings- or consumer outrage. It's not a change due to a new platform- a new audience. It is a pointless change and as the players- we deserve more than anyone else to be given a reason for it. And if they're incapable of providing a reason... as they are.. then even moreso we deserve to be able to change it. We are not altering the game and playing dev here- we are asking for an experience closer to what was promised to us. Something as close to All The Content that is legally possible to bring(We understand about licensing issues with upcoming banners..)- and the PSO2 JP version brought to the west as true to itself as it can be.

@Anarchy-Marine said in Removing Height Restrictions:

Well, if I had to guess, it would be the same reason Tera Online censored the outfits of the North American releases outfits of the Elin.

This actually did not happen. The only outfit that got changed for the Elin was their starting inner wear, no other costumes for them have been changed or censored.

Also the height difference is very noticeable otherwise people wouldn't be complaining about it.

@Zizel said in Removing Height Restrictions:

@Anarchy-Marine said in Removing Height Restrictions:

Well, if I had to guess, it would be the same reason Tera Online censored the outfits of the North American releases outfits of the Elin.

This actually did not happen. The only outfit that got changed for the Elin was their starting inner wear, no other costumes for them have been changed or censored.

Also the height difference is very noticeable otherwise people wouldn't be complaining about it.

The midrift of the US version on several of the outfits were removed, the outfits themselves, including many of the swimsuits were censored as well, the company cited an issue with western audiences not being used to those types of characters in skimpy outfits running around. This information can be proved by comparing the Jappanese version, with the western version, and several searches on your preferred search engine. You clearly haven't seen how bad cancel culture has gotten for them to make those choices.

It is true that Japanese culture has very different limits on what is considered decent or indecent for clothing and relations, but that has zero bearing on physical height.