Removing Height Restrictions

@MoldyAsp33874 said in Removing Height Restrictions:

It has now been over 2 months since @GM-Deynger said he would be look into talking to the web team about getting a poll up about this. I guess they either said no- or It's Complicated.. Or nothing was actually communicated and he was just trying to pacify the thread hoping that it would just die out from natural causes.

We have said what we wanted to say- there is no arguing for the restriction to exist. If there was- this thread would be dozens of more pages long- It's just everyone in agreement with more and more reasons why they do so..

I +1 everything MoldyAsp said in that post (not gonna re-quote entire thing)

look.. i don't have much more to offer at this point, other than my opinion.

i dont call myself a "fan" cause i'm not a "fanatic", i just have moments of "fanning" over stuff.. but i've always had fond memories of SEGA from childhood. I even lived close enough to REGULARLY VISIT The "Sega World" at Innoventions & my first 'owned' games were Sonic 1 & 2.

I want SEGA to be successful and do well, as i know first hand they have some great minds creating amazing things behind the scenes.

I cannot, or rather feel it inappropriate to try giving DETAILED marketing advice all in one thread. as 1 thing out of context or misunderstood can make a MAJOR impact.

but i can say, its a huge part about knowing your target audience. and doing your best to respect their "expectations".

many Trailers or marketing campaigns lie. and while it may get a spike for 1 day where everyone comes to checkout what you have. MOST will feel betrayed, get offended, and leave IF they feel they've been mislead under false pretenses.

i appreciate that Sega has not overly promised things in the new NGS trailer. although its still (slightly) concerning with the lack of information we were given.

its a teaser.

something to get the mouth wet.

i'm not trying to imply, that i didnt like what i saw....

but that it didn't seem to really show much. other than a day night cycle. which looks beautiful. really amazing. if its optimized well, i will probably fall in love with NGS.

still, i found it pretty lackluster for how AMAZING i know PSO actually IS.

really wish whoever handles the marketing could do a better job for the NA release. but my point wasnt JUST about the poor marketing.

its about honesty/respect for customer expectations.

Sure, not everyone grew up playing a Sega Genesis, or knew that everyone loved how Sega didn't hold back when it came to releasing ARCADE titles as close to their original as possible. blood n all. (hello mortal kombat?)

but many of us (i'd imagine) are still rooting for Sega in our own quiet corner, hoping they'll respect that we are mostly all a bit older now. and generally more mature in this day.

Please if anyone at Sega can kindly consider the views in this thread. on your own terms of course.

You could easily remove a lot of DOUBT from the community by letting the players know "the height feature will be added back in, at a later update."

I've waited many years for the US to see another PSO title. I hope i can play this game (for 10++ years) or until i DO actually retire from gaming.

I like spending money (when i have it) and plan to spend hundreds each year on this game.

BUT.. the NA monetization seems very "off-putting" aka Bad Business Practices. I'd been blaming MS, but really it doesn't matter who's entirely at fault.

There are issues that need fixing. or at least acknowledgement that they exist OR will be investigated.

I can't say if I'd transfer to JP (if only that was an option..) as for me, the main reason i didn't play on JP client much, was that i didn't want to burden the JP players with a communication barrier. (& the rumors that non JP players weren't welcome, didn't help.)

I'll do everything reasonably that i can to help promote the game & encourage a fun time for the playerbase.

but i personally, do need signs of "good will" in order for me to put my reputation on the line and recommend things WHOLEHEARTEDLY to the people in my life. Honor is something very important to me, wither it is to others or not.

all i'd ask is to please respect your players and at your earliest fair opportunity, communicate with us as honestly as possible. (honoring NDAs of course!)

Thank you. & I'd be happy to offer classic Marketing tips which most of the new people in the biz have neglected to remember. if requested, am sure we could work out a deal.

Reliable information that people trust, about an exciting innovative product. is what hooks your target audience.

Cheers!

@ZorokiHanuke You know.. I've tried learning it and I still don't understand it.

Much like mahjong which sorta plays like Poker.

Im fine with height restrictions. Keeps the lolis in strings out. Improves my PSO2 experience muchly, glad the same will happen in NGS aka Episode 7 aka lolPSO3.

Kek

100% totally serious comment. Totally not just trying to be a contrarian. 45 pages of no one vouching for the restriction but a few comments after I pointed that out someone shows up to say they want it.

Very legit.
Also PSO2NGS isn't Ep 7 OR pso3. PSO2 is going to be dev'd alongside PSO2NGS. It's still getting an Ep7. And you're still grabbing PSO2NGS from the PSO2 client. Closest thing to the truth is that it's a reboot of PSO2.

@MoldyAsp33874 said in Removing Height Restrictions:

100% totally serious comment. Totally not just trying to be a contrarian. 45 pages of no one vouching for the restriction but a few comments after I pointed that out someone shows up to say they want it.

Very legit.
Also PSO2NGS isn't Ep 7 OR pso3. PSO2 is going to be dev'd alongside PSO2NGS. It's still getting an Ep7. And you're still grabbing PSO2NGS from the PSO2 client. Closest thing to the truth is that it's a reboot of PSO2.

And this here boys and girls is the EXACT kinda sucker SEGA is banking on. 🙂

Sighs, but ill take a serious tone for a bit.

No, their wont be a Episode 7, JP PSO2 is getting their final story update that wraps the entire Oracle Saga up soon, the final Profound Darkness Battle. If anything, maybe, just maybe, they will do a short and sweet, episode 7, sometime before NGS aka PSO3 launches, but then thats it.

Ship blocks have already been depopulating cuz of this announcement, cuz its common sense to realize, this is the end of PSO2, its got a year left, after that when NGS aka PSO3 releases, everyone will be playing that, since barely anything anyone does in PSO2 now will have much effect in NGS.

Players will only go to play PSO2 for anything that can be transferred over, like Camos, outfits, etc. Titles maybe. Otherwise, nearly the whole player population will be on NGS aka PSO3. What makes this even worse is the UQs that require a certain amount of kill completion. If SEGA does not lower the completion requirements for those specific UQs, then no ones gonna be able to do the end bosses for those anymore.

Did you see anywhere on the trailer that they will continue development for PSO2 once Genesis is released? I sure didnt, I looked at both NA trailers twice over to be sure. Did not see it. If they did that it would have assuaged alot of fears and concerns by the ones they are hoping will keep shelling out that AC Moolah, basically the gullible whales and dolphins.

But they didnt...... you know why? Cuz they do not intend to. Its that simple. Once New Gen is out they will keep old PSO2 going until theirs no population left, then they will close the servers to further reduce costs. Their is no reason whatsoever to spend development resources on PSO2 base beyond a Graphics overhaul. Its likely they even stated they would give PSO2 base the new graphics treatment to basically trick players into thinking they will keep adding more to PSO2.

Lad, I been playing video games for over 30 years, mmos for 20. I seen all the tricks and business practices, whats rocket science to you would be common sense to me. But hey, if you wanna keep spending money, whaling and wasting your time by all means go for it. Ima just play enough to get titles, do new stuff as it comes in and by the final Episode aka 6, will make the best weapons and units I can to transfer with me to PSO3, which will become obsolete real fast anyway.

Gonna also note another good point, most players, who are casual btw, does, not, have, time, to, play, two, mmos. NGS is a completely new game. Its only similarities to PSO2 is races, the UI which was redone, and the fact its a Action RPG like the original. This is what SEGA has been working on in secret for a few years now. Its what SEGA will hopefully not fall into the trap that is the super inflation of Meseta and the ridiculous power creep thats occurred on JP, as well as the fact that some classes are just so damn OP that serious Teams/Alliances will ask you to be that meta to run with them, or dont go at all.

Sighs, well, thats the last time ima explain things to sheep. Now back on topic.

I prefer they keep the height restrictions. My 13 year old niece is playing now, rather not her mother catches her playing while a nearby player who is chair dancing has the appearance of a 11 year old girl, aka no chest, and no hips that should make that string bikini shes wearing impossible to stay on.

Yup.

I prefer they keep the height restrictions. My 13 year old niece is playing now, rather not her mother catches her playing while a nearby player who is chair dancing has the appearance of a 11 year old girl, aka no chest, and no hips that should make that string bikini shes wearing impossible to stay on.

I don't know about you, but I wouldn't let a 13 year old play a game where these kinds of "outfits" are commonplace, no matter if they're on an avatar who looks 11 or 21

The game's rating is M, by the way. A 13 year old objectively shouldn't be playing this.

@TheMerfox said in Removing Height Restrictions:

I prefer they keep the height restrictions. My 13 year old niece is playing now, rather not her mother catches her playing while a nearby player who is chair dancing has the appearance of a 11 year old girl, aka no chest, and no hips that should make that string bikini shes wearing impossible to stay on.

I don't know about you, but I wouldn't let a 13 year old play a game where these kinds of "outfits" are commonplace, no matter if they're on an avatar who looks 11 or 21

The game's rating is M, by the way. A 13 year old objectively shouldn't be playing this.

I guess 13 year olds shouldn't be allowed at the beach. Actually, I guess they shouldn't be allowed outside in general.

Edit: Also, while it was M in beta, you should really check the homepage and scroll down now:

alt text

@Shadowth117 I took the Mature rating from the Microsoft store, actually. You'll notice that, unlike the store's Mature rating, the website's Teen rating doesn't include partial nudity, of which the game has a good quantity.

82984a8a-e29f-49a9-9b2b-060ef1de47da-image.png

Also, it's not about telling teenagers to not go outside. Alexandrioius's logic is that he doesn't want his niece's mother to see her playing a game with questionable content, which the game already has with the outfits I showed.

FYI, just like the movie/television ratings, the video game ESRB (the US standards) has a very obscure and finicky standards. Where one game (similar to movies/shows) can go through rating hell, another nearly, vastly identical (or at the very least, similar) game will get a much easier and lower rating while actually showing much more "mature" content.

The ratings (the US standards) are literally subjective opinions of certain hand picked random individuals for different genres based on an outdated personal moral code.

Basic Generalization Examples(all in the idea of offline play): Sci-Fi game? Will bounce between T and M, mainly due to expressing extra terrestrial life, and advancements of universal technologies with little to zero religious influence, and non earth human+human relationships (or non hetero relationships), and the occasional naughty word.

Fantasy game? Most likely will be T to M, mainly due to non mainstream religious magic, monsters and mythical creatures, and non earth human+human or hetero relationships, and the few naughty words spoken.

Fighting games? Will always be T to M, not due to the fighting; unless really going into graphic/gore. It really is due to character designs (females) and the occasional naughty word here and there.

(FP)Shooters games? Will always be T to M, not really due to the fighting; unless really going into graphic/gore. It really is due to the naughty words spoken in intense situations.

(J)RPGs games? Same as the others T to M, mainly due to non mainstream religious magic, monsters and mythical creatures, and non earth human+human, female designs, and you guessed it... a naughty word sometimes.

As Kyle's mom, Mrs. Sheila Broflovski once said - "Remember what the MPAA says; Horrific, Deplorable violence is okay, as long as people don't say any naughty words! That's what this war is all about!" Which, ironically rings true, across all media rating systems.

Take away the very few swears already in this game (and maybe the gambling simulator), and it probably could be dropped to an E(10+) by the ESRB. Yes that includes keeping the current outfits in game, and that is if SEGA wanted to fork out a few extra $$$ towards the ESRB (similar to what Disney did with their Toontown game to keep low E rating, and to allow the use "NYC style chance games(which is still gambling)" and to have words like Hell, Crap and Damn spoken from baddies and have dynamite as a weapon against the baddies cause "cartoon violence" is not real.)

@Alexandrious947 said in Removing Height Restrictions:

Im fine with height restrictions. Keeps the lolis in strings out. Improves my PSO2 experience muchly, glad the same will happen in NGS aka Episode 7 aka lolPSO3.

Kek

Despite me being in favor of the removal of said restriction, I really understand this point. Why? Because different people have different views, and someone's experience may or may not be influenced by what others do or show around them. In the case of this poster, they not just don't want the limit to apply to themselves, but to everyone else. They simply don't want the stuff showing up on their screen at all. And that's a valid point and why I also advocated for local client files.

Since the height difference between NA and JP doesn't seem too large, collision detection shouldn't suffer if a player could toggle height restrictions for everyone, on or off. That way those who do not want to see short characters can simply leave the limit toggled on and all characters will look at the currently censored height, while those who want the full sliders can toggle the limit off. Best of both worlds approach, again, >IF< the collision models won't suffer from it.

@SleeprunnerInc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogmGCkFk1mI

This guy made it look easy

I can't imagine the sense of being okay with a chair-dancing flatchested string-bikini wearing girl who is 5ft but not one who is 4'9. Though you can see both at any beach.(though maybe not chair-dancing).. Height is relative among countries and has nothing to do with age. If you believe flat-chest = young. Then they should have changed the boob slider instead of the height slider- it would have made a lot more sense with the narrative.

@MoldyAsp33874 said in Removing Height Restrictions:

I can't imagine the sense of being okay with a chair-dancing flatchested string-bikini wearing girl who is 5ft but not one who is 4'9. Though you can see both at any beach.(though maybe not chair-dancing).. Height is relative among countries and has nothing to do with age. If you believe flat-chest = young. Then they should have changed the boob slider instead of the height slider- it would have made a lot more sense with the narrative.

Don't worry, by the next game, all females will be minimum 6ft tall with minimum D cups and low toned voices.... or, a single unmodifiable model.. or better, everyone will be male for the best effect! After all, nobody says flak about Doom for having only the Doom Guy as playable. 👺

Really, as I said before, I DO understand the people not wanting to even see that, and I also understand if Sega used these western morals as base for the censor (IF that was indeed the reason and if this was indeed a censor. hard to know when there's zero response). I know that a blanket "No" that covers all bases is much easier to implement than trying to please all sides. BUT, the fact that the game already shows as M rated on the Microsoft Store, and games like Blade and Soul and Tera among others, have absolutely no problem showing even younger looking characters in such outfits and situations, and the fact that previous PS titles allowed short characters, makes this censor (again IF it's a censor after all) rather pointless. Then there's the part about players wanting non sexualized short characters, like short male Casts to name one type, who are people who usually pay more for cosmetics for their preferred looks.

And I say this from a more neutral standpoint, trying to use what's left of my logic to analyze it.

It's really unfortunate that it seems like they've decided to ignore us. I'm all for the instruction we've been given that we should keep this topic to one thread in the forum, but its starting to feel like a means of putting us in quarantine rather than giving us a platform to actually discuss the issue.

I'm gonna suggest that some of you start doing what I've been doing, which is gently reminding the PSO2NA team via their various social media channels that we're still here and we still want this decision reverted. I'm not rude when I do so. I don't try to hijack conversations or advertisements for new content. I let them know that the update is looking good and that I'm excited to play it, but also remind them that the height slider still needs to be fixed.

Because with the exception of a vocal minority who are vocally opposed to lifting the height restrictions, we're kind of just talking into an echo chamber here. Nothing is going to change at this rate. But I think we can be more vocal about this on other platforms, as long as we're civil about it and don't give them a reason to delete our opinions.

Well with the Steam release now confirmed for August 5th- the forums might get some new voices. Hopefully those voices don't lead to this thread being locked away. Lets all try to remain as calm as possible about this. This thread is a testament that there is still people waiting for some reassurance that they can play a product closer to the JP version without too many restrictions on future cosmetics- Devs picking and choosing what they perceive as going too far for NA sensibilities.- They could remove things such as randoseru and the school outfits and just use the blanket excuse of "Well- these are more a JP culture thing and so we didn't think there would be any demand for them in NA"- but the truth is that it's a simple thing to bring over and more freedom is better than less. Give the players the choice to use a feature or not rather than predetermining their mental states are unfit for the consumption of such features.

Holy crap 45 pages? I'm personally glad I don't have to catch glimpse of someone's dumb 13 year old character with D-cups poledancing around the lobby offering "services" for meseta, but you guys keep fighting the good fight I guess.