I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event

@SleeprunnerInc They can voice their opinion but unfortunately opinions can be inherently flawed as OP's is but you guys do you.

@KLB600 I mean yes and no.

When your opinion holds no weight and is only there to tell someone else to stfu then that's not really an opinion but a statement which is really uncalled for.

Cause what would the GM use as feedback?

Someone voicing valid points (NOT ALL OF EM) or the people saying STFU, Grow a thicker skin, you are an idiot etc.

@SleeprunnerInc said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

@TrekkiesUnite The GM's take in to consideration every single thing we say more or less.

Telling someone to get a thicker skin is not good feedback.

It's perfectly fine feedback in this context.

@SleeprunnerInc said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

Why post?

For attention?

That's the OP.

@TrekkiesUnite said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

@SleeprunnerInc said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

@TrekkiesUnite The GM's take in to consideration every single thing we say more or less.

Telling someone to get a thicker skin is not good feedback.

It's perfectly fine feedback in this context.

@SleeprunnerInc said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

Why post?

For attention?

That's the OP.

Not really mate.

It's quite childish for the most part.

And I'm pretty sure the GM would agree on that part as that's not really discussing the topic but just trying to tell them to shut up.

@SleeprunnerInc said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

@TrekkiesUnite said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

@SleeprunnerInc said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

@TrekkiesUnite The GM's take in to consideration every single thing we say more or less.

Telling someone to get a thicker skin is not good feedback.

It's perfectly fine feedback in this context.

@SleeprunnerInc said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

Why post?

For attention?

That's the OP.

Not really mate.

It's quite childish for the most part.

And I'm pretty sure the GM would agree on that part as that's not really discussing the topic but just trying to tell them to shut up.

The topic itself is inherently loaded and flawed. It's entire purpose is to stir up drama and give the OP attention. It's for this reason that there's nothing to discuss and it should have just been thrown out.

@TrekkiesUnite If you think that, then there's nothing left to discuss.

I'll still be chatting and discussing this topic with the OP and others who do want to chat about it in a polite manner.

I remember as a little Girl going to a theme park on the week of the Independence holiday, Within the theme park, As a patron, I was able to see the park employees dress up in the clothing as they did way back in the 1700's. It made the 4th , Just that much more prominent of a holiday, I got to see where Abraham Lincoln was having a Presidential Debate with Benjamin Franklin. Even the food was made like it was back then. The highlight of our day was of course the Fireworks.

sigh... How I miss those days.

But to later have someone administer this Holiday with something negative? It just shows how really uneducated said individual can be. I think The OP conclusion is more baised than anything and is compounded into something of a personal issue.

This thread has done everything but tell each other to take a long walk on a short pier.

This event. It is a parody. Not the movie/showrunner traditional comical parody, but as an outsider's satirical viewpoint. The over saturation of the ideologies seen from a few eras mashed together with subtle but not subtle view point, to achieve a bit of extra money market flow. Nothing more, nothing less.

@DDDDLife Honestly if the dude is actually facing somethign as he claims then I can understand his point completely.

For the most part and for alot of us, I doubt we see these issues that he speaks of as they are supposedly targeting a minority.

But I would love to see even a singular recorded instance of this BEFORE fully aknowledging his view.

So far, I can only understand his points and just chat about it since nothing will change most likely which is fine.

So I obviously have no authority over anyone here, but I would like to calmly urge everyone to let cooler heads prevail and do our best to be polite and respectful. Behind each of these avatars and comments are people with feelings, who as far as we know are more alike to ourselves than different despite the differing views we may have on these sensitive subjects. I know I myself have made some insensitive comments that have contributed to this atmosphere, but I'd like us to remember what we're all working towards here. We all want to feel included, welcomed, acknowledged and be able to enjoy this game together.

For some of us this event makes us feel included, welcomed and acknowledged. For others, it does the opposite. I don't want to take away those feelings from the first group, but I hope the people in the first group can acknowledge the feelings of those in the second group.

Recently we've had some posts refer back to my original topic. I'll admit that I could have framed it more diplomatically, but I didn't expect this thread or my account to survive past the first page so I took a hard line stance in the hopes of sending a message. While the words written therein do represent my heart of hearts, I am also open to dialogue and compromise. When you start negotiating, it's a bad tactic to ask for less than what you actually expect ot get, and a good tactic to ask for more. I don't realisticly expect this event or these symbols to be removed, but what middle ground can we find between those who do want them in the game and those who don't?

I'm not sure where this will all lead, but for now I'm satisfied that we're having this dialogue. As such, it's in my interest to try to keep this topic on course and not get it locked. Thus I implore all of you to treat your fellow members of this community with respect.

Thank you.

@TrekkiesUnite said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

No it doesn't. They're just settings and inanimate objects.

Except they're not. Symbols have meaning for a reason or else they wouldn't be used. The Yamato was chosen because of what it is and what it represents, or else they would have made up a fictional battle ship and called it something else. The stars and stripes were used because of what it is and what it represents, or else they would have made up a fictional flag for a fictional country and called it something else. The idea that things exist purely in a political void is a falsehood because everything - every piece of media - is political in some way, shape or form. People don't just "create politics" my dude; things aren't either political or not, you seem to think things are only political when they don't align with your political spectrum - but that's the thing. Everything is political and things don't stop being so when people aren't actively disagreeing with one another.

Even outside of episode 4 the game's story doesn't shy away from themes and concepts brought about by its creator's political and world views, as every work of fiction is. The game doesn't suddenly "get" political because one person takes issue with one event: it always was and always will be, willful ignorance isn't much of an excuse to demand other people stop talking about a subject.

@SleeprunnerInc

Someone voicing valid points (NOT ALL OF EM) or the people saying STFU, Grow a thicker skin, you are an idiot etc.

The flawed logic, misconstrued understanding of history, symbols and holidays by O.P has already been made apparent by many here. Your bias shows when you only focus on the parts you don't like.

This is a non issue and isn't worth discussing anymore, I tried but it just isn't.

@SleeprunnerInc said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

@DDDDLife Honestly if the dude is actually facing somethign as he claims then I can understand his point completely.

For the most part and for alot of us, I doubt we see these issues that he speaks of as they are supposedly targeting a minority.

But I would love to see even a singular recorded instance of this BEFORE fully aknowledging his view.

So far, I can only understand his points and just chat about it since nothing will change most likely which is fine.

When I saw this thread return from the grave, my objective changed from trying to simply send a message to trying to create a dialogue, raise awareness and hopefully inspire other people who feel the similarily to make their voices heard. Ideally, I would like this thread to grow beyond me and my greivences, which is why I've been so vague about who I am and what my background is and what my situation is that makes me feel this way, instead focusing on more general issues that would be more widely relatable. I am also reluctent to get into those details because I fear that would shift the focus of this thread from addressing these issues to putting my lived experiences on trial to determine whether my feelings are justified, which I obviously think the are, but you know how these things can be.

While I might still get into those details after some more consideration, as things are now I've more or less said my piece and made all the points I can reasonably make without doing so. As such I'm thinking of stepping back from this thread for a bit and seeing if anyone steps foreward to take my place in leading the conversation (though I still might pop in now and again to respond to a particularily interesting comment). If no one else does so I'll have to weigh the cost of continuing this struggle alone or simply accepting that I'm the lone radical anti-imperialist here and keep my eccentricities to myself, which will likely entail not playing PSO2 anymore, at least for the duration of this event.

I'll leave you all, for now, with this request: when you're celebrating Independence Day this year, assuming you do so, I'd like you to look upon your flag and suspend whatever feelings you have for it and spend a moment to think about the people who see or would have seen that flag as an icon of oppression, imperialism and colonialism. The intimidated, the extorted, the invaded, the bombed, the imprisoned, the destabilized, the divested, the assimilated, the annihilated. Then, when you've done that, think about what positive things you'd like that flag to mean. Don't let it have an intrinsic positive meaning, give it one, a personal one, from your own life and experiences. That would let me rest easy knowing that you're not honouring a symbol of imperialism or nationalism, but honouring the banner of your ideals. Feel free to share the meaning of your flag, too. I may not be able to see the good in the US flag, but maybe I can see the good in the banner of your own ideals.

Thank you.

@NeirasRothmagia said in I am very disapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

So I obviously have no authority over anyone here, but I would like to calmly urge everyone to let cooler heads prevail and do our best to be polite and respectful. Behind each of these avatars and comments are people with feelings, who as far as we know are more alike to ourselves than different despite the differing views we may have on these sensitive subjects. I know I myself have made some insensitive comments that have contributed to this atmosphere, but I'd like us to remember what we're all working towards here. We all want to feel included, welcomed, acknowledged and be able to enjoy this game together.

For some of us this event makes us feel included, welcomed and acknowledged. For others, it does the opposite. I don't want to take away those feelings from the first group, but I hope the people in the first group can acknowledge the feelings of those in the second group.

Recently we've had some posts refer back to my original topic. I'll admit that I could have framed it more diplomatically, but I didn't expect this thread or my account to survive past the first page so I took a hard line stance in the hopes of sending a message. While the words written therein do represent my heart of hearts, I am also open to dialogue and compromise. When you start negotiating, it's a bad tactic to ask for less than what you actually expect ot get, and a good tactic to ask for more. I don't realisticly expect this event or these symbols to be removed, but what middle ground can we find between those who do want them in the game and those who don't?

I'm not sure where this will all lead, but for now I'm satisfied that we're having this dialogue. As such, it's in my interest to try to keep this topic on course and not get it locked. Thus I implore all of you to treat your fellow members of this community with respect.

Thank you.

Im sorry.. But I wanted to say this for a while now. You are a real BONEHEAD! Get a Freaking Grip!

@NeirasRothmagia said in I am very dissapointed in PSO2 for having this Independence Day event:

I'd like you to look upon your flag and suspend whatever feelings you have for it and spend a moment to think about the people who see that flag as an icon of oppression, imperialism and colonialism.

After skimming through this thread the past couple days, I decided to log in to the forums for the first time to just say this:

I don't let any symbol—no matter what—dictate dictate how I feel towards anything. I let specifically the actions of others do so. I encourage you and anyone else who feels the same as you do the same.

Focus on individuals rather than iconography.

That being said. I do hate this thread, and am quite sour toward you for making it. Please refrain from bringing politics into my escapism.

Thank you.