Price fixing?

I'm on ship 2 and I noticed a guy has 34 dance20 tickets all priced at almost 18mil. What is the price of that ticket on Ship 1 and 3?

If it's significantly lower on 1 and 3, this is obviously a case of JP players exploiting the easily exploited market system on items that they know people will want. If this is the case, then items people will want will never be low priced, as those players will buy up all ignorant player's stock of the desirable item and instantly reprice it higher, making hundreds of millions of meseta if people still buy it.

Needless to say, you'll have a smaller playerbase if people who play the game without spending tons of real life cash cannot reasonably buy anything that's actually good with in game meseta. Either that, or they will start using meseta selling sites as long as the site offers meseta at a lower cost than what it would take to acquire the item via AC/SG.

Basically, I could go on and on about how this could be a bad thing, but first I'd like to know if it is happening.

@XbloodymonarchX said in Price fixing?:

I'm on ship 2 and I noticed a guy has 34 dance20 tickets all priced at almost 18mil. What is the price of that ticket on Ship 1 and 3?

If it's significantly lower on 1 and 3, this is obviously a case of JP players exploiting the easily exploited market system on items that they know people will want. If this is the case, then items people will want will never be low priced, as those players will buy up all ignorant player's stock of the desirable item and instantly reprice it higher, making hundreds of millions of meseta if people still buy it.

Needless to say, you'll have a smaller playerbase if people who play the game without spending tons of real life cash cannot reasonably buy anything that's actually good with in game meseta. Either that, or they will start using meseta selling sites as long as the site offers meseta at a lower cost than what it would take to acquire the item via AC/SG.

Basically, I could go on and on about how this could be a bad thing, but first I'd like to know if it is happening.

I already said why this happened. xbox players had 2 months to stockpile meseta.

  • Staggered release
  • Make some content disappear before a large probably majority portion of the players who want it can get it naturally
  • A market system that encourages upselling
  • A history in other MMOs of players who get access to the game earlier exploiting the players who play it later

Gee, I wonder how that's going to end up!

Here's what you do - and some of you may be sick of hearing me say it, but it's true that it would fix yet another problem now - you re-run the natural distribution of the content and let all the new players get it either the same way older players could (or if that is not possible, either a comparable way or just make it a login reward).

Then they don't get angry at being punished for late access and the jerk upsellers get punished for hoarding items to exploit that suddenly plummet in value.

Win freaking win.

Long-term solution, make a public declaration that most or all limited-time content - at the very least the content given freely - will always reappear on a long cycle. This will encourage some players who missed out to wait several months for natural access (others will still get impatient and buy - that's cool too) and discourage hoarding which creates a negative market environment.

If it were fixed prices, their AC sells would be too low to make a successful game over here.

Hoarding items to resale after their limited period is over is the only reason that so much AC gets bought.

You can't fix the op's issue damage is already done. Its not items needing to be recycled.

Its the surplus of gold that just bought up all the cosmetics day 1.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Price fixing?:

Hoarding items to resale after their limited period is over is the only reason that so much AC gets bought.

If you mean hoarding from the market, I disagree.

Take an item that would sell for 100k if it has an uncertain future. Presently when it reaches a critical mass of availability, someone with infinite money from their headstart is going to pick them all up and jack the price up to 20 million. If it was known that it would reappear in a future or re-run AC scratch (as many sets are in JP by the way) but no sooner than, say, within 12 months(1) of its last appearance, those 100k listings would still go but to players who actually want them instead because the upsellers would consider them less exploitable. The reasonably-priced supply will still be taken up, you just eliminate the phenomenon of forcing poor players to become even poorer to make the rich players richer.

(1) By the way I say 12 months because that's apparently the upper bound of time for consoles (or more recently PC storefronts) to get all the benefit they feel they need from exclusivity deals for games and content packs, and typically the time that pre-order or crowdfunding-reward exclusivity lasts too. But some of them do less (Borderlands 3 on the Epic store for instance being 6 months).

If you mean fewer people would buy AC tickets because the items they get from them sell for less meseta, again, no? AC scratch tickets don't insert meseta into the economy, so the amount of disposable income players have remains the same. All delayed re-releases would do is shift where that money goes, i.e. less of it going directly into the pockets of greedy upsellers and more of it circulating in a generally more healthy way. And considering the whole Star Gem accumulation mechanic for outerwear and outfits, there is definitely a natural cause of prices of all AC content to rise after the set concludes. Just not to unreasonable extents with the benefit going to upsellers rather than people who bought the AC in the first place.

(Also, I think players being priced out of items they want by greedy upsellers will make them dissatisfied and contribute to some of them quitting the game, which means the present situation sees less meseta being generated and the average AC pull selling for less, although I expect this will be quite a minor effect).

@Ship04 said in Price fixing?:

You can't fix the op's issue damage is already done. Its not items needing to be recycled. Its the surplus of gold that just bought up all the cosmetics day 1.

It's both, really. To answer the OP's unanswered question: The cheapest 110: Dance 20 on Ship 3 is 52,500,000 meseta.

There are only four on sale in the entire ship, primarily owing to it coming from the Recruit Line AC scratch which was the first scratch set, and at the time of its introduction Ship 3 had only just been added, so not only were there the fewest players of the three ships but they were all new (the Xbox fresh start) so their cash spend was likely still prioritising the founders packs and starter upgrades like character and inventory space.

Ship 3 surely has the highest proportion of new PC players who couldn't even play the first four AC scratch sets and the first seven? FUN scratch sets. This means a greater portion of the players today couldn't generate the items in those sets, and in turn Ship 3 has the greatest exposure to an epidemic of price gouging by the pre-PC players. If everyone had been allowed to naturally do those scratch sets, the value of their items within them would be remotely natural. Which is why I believe they should be allowed to in the near future.

@Miraglyth no, buying from the market does 't make sense anyways regarding my AC sales bit.

I certainly wouldn't find much value in AC scratching if it would earn me less meseta than 1 single weekly mission. Limited availability items are always goldmines in any game with an open market. Any game that has allowed RMT (no point in fluffing it) wouldn't repeat a sale of items within the same quarter, so it is almost always a safe bet to refrain from selling until it's natural availability is gone.

I had 1 mil meseta when PC joined. PC players got to join when Pole Dance was obtainable, which was an instant 10m meseta. When xbox started emotes barely sold for more than 200K. Unfair advantage of PC players, smh.

@John-Paul-RAGE

I'm not suggesting we price fix items. I'm saying that other players are buying up all of the items that are known to be desired and "fixing" the price higher. I guess a better way to phrase it would have been "upselling" as mentioned in this thread.

@XbloodymonarchX makes sense, but there are some people that will max put credit cards, so some of those may have been legit scratches as well.

@XbloodymonarchX said in Price fixing?:

@John-Paul-RAGE

I'm not suggesting we price fix items. I'm saying that other players are buying up all of the items that are known to be desired and "fixing" the price higher. I guess a better way to phrase it would have been "upselling" as mentioned in this thread.

With the mesetta that they had with 2 months headstart.

Buying cheap and selling higher is the very definition of money making. Who goes into business to break even? Learn the market and start making money, don't bush us who buy up items that will sell higher at a later time.

Yeah i saw that and I was like...oh boy this ain't gonna be pretty for NA market. SEA had this issue back then and the price went nuts into 100M just for most of the stuff. This also because SEA player bought meseta from gold seller and the market become broken. Other player couldn't buy anything good because the price is ridiculous and so they move to JP and lead to SEA server shutdown.

This also concern me in NA. If player is taking all the good stuff that other players want and placed the price too expensive, everything else will be just like that. Old items will become expensive instead cheaper like in JP. My friend who play in JP told me everything can be purchase below 5M, dance and other. When the item become old, the price become cheaper and not expensive, instead I saw the price in NA become expensive which worries me. This could lead to player buy meseta from Gold seller because they believe they can't get the item they want to just from farming (or it will take for ever), either that or they will quit and move back to JP.

I mean sure, its your item, your choice, I'am just saying this will lead the same problem that SEA had. I do hope I'am wrong. (apologize for my Eng)

Issue like this is why I support a fixed price system in MMOs sure it can devalue rare items and overprice trash items (perfect example of that happening being BDO) if not done correctly but it limits the influence gold sellers have and keeps the market some what stable when people try to brake it, which can easily be done. I've already seen people mass buying any lvl 15 skills on ship 3's market and reselling them for insane prices. How do I know this cause someone that bought 10 off me are now reselling the 10 he bought for triple what I sold them for.

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Price fixing?:

@Miraglyth no, buying from the market does 't make sense anyways regarding my AC sales bit.

I certainly wouldn't find much value in AC scratching if it would earn me less meseta than 1 single weekly mission.

Sorry I wasn't clear enough. My point was this wouldn't happen. If (1) 50 people get Random Jacket [Ou] from an AC set and (2) 100 people with an average of (3) 20 million meseta spendable money want it over the (4) 6 months following the end of its availability, having it reappear in a set every 12-18 months doesn't change variables 2, 3 or 4, does it?

Supply and demand dictates a largely unaffected price, unless you want to consider greedy resellers part of the demand too. (They're not, they're just an extra step in the consumption process that snaps up remaining copies of something at its normal price when there's 5-20 left on the market and then jack the price up. The person who bought the AC Scratch ticket doesn't benefit in money terms when they sell it for the same amount either way, they just get that money a little sooner).

@John-Paul-RAGE said in Price fixing?:

Any game that has allowed RMT (no point in fluffing it) wouldn't repeat a sale of items within the same quarter, so it is almost always a safe bet to refrain from selling until it's natural availability is gone.

Good thing that's pretty much already happened on Ship 3 then, thanks to how few of the early scratches were sold. And to remind, that point only applies to AC scratches. It's frankly disgusting that this is also the case for items that a special minority were able to get for doing 4 urgent quests or even just logging in.

PC players got to join when Pole Dance was obtainable, which was an instant 10m meseta. When xbox started emotes barely sold for more than 200K. Unfair advantage of PC players, smh.

What... is your point here? Rare AC pulls will sell for a lot due to demand, yes. If Pole Dance was 10m before it stopped being available on AC Scratch, clearly it still being available at the time didn't cause it to be worth "less meseta than 1 single weekly mission". So how would the knowledge that it would return with the same low pull rarity 18 months later do that all of a sudden?

If that was the case, nothing from any presently available AC set would be worth millions (which by the way PC players can afford less right now still being less than two weeks into the game), and yet they demonstrably are.

@LazyGamerPeon said in Price fixing?:

don't bush us who buy up items that will sell higher at a later time.

Don't "bush us" who actually wanted the things being exploited but weren't able to get them because Sega didn't let us play when they were available, sometimes with ridiculously simple requirements.

Honestly I can understand why some people took advantage of the favouritism but I still think it's extremely scummy. No item that required just logging in should already be worth over 5 million. I don't think they should ever be worth that much, and any such item distributed that way now we can all get them the intended way probably never will be. The only reason earlier ones are exorbitantly overpriced is that the supply was heavily artificially limited by said favouritism and I think that is just wrong.

@John-Paul-RAGE Wait, I joined when the NA PC launch started.

Where the heck did you obtain the poledance emote?

Was it available for 1-2 days?

Cause I surely didn't see it anywhere.