I don't see any real reason why symbol arts should have been removed, and Sega should bring them back ASAP.

First of all I'd argue that the game loses something for not having this feature. One of the best parts of PSO2 is how driven it is by geek culture. We have several crossover designs and characters, from Vocaloid to Persona to the plethora of anime injected into the game. Taking away symbol art removes a lot of the expression via memes, and cultural reference that has breathed so much life into the game, and offers a social experience far more grand than any other MMO/Looter game. From WoW to GW2 to FFXIV to BDO; there is no competition to the level of social interaction and how well this game facilitates it; and symbol arts are a part of that. Name one other MMO/Looter/RPG that allows for someone to get smacked down by a boss, where you can literally respond with a surprised pika face, a popular meme broadcast to everyone to display your shock in how you ended up in that situation, regardless of vet or newcomer. This is something special about PSO2+NGS and it should be preserved.

Toxicity alone isn't a valid reason. Anyone can be "toxic" with anything; including simple auto chats. An "op in" function was reasonable to allow the more sensitive people to not have to partake or see anything they view as offensive, while also protecting streamers; but that standard shouldn't have to apply to everyone who can handle it and is not easily offended. There is no reason to detract from everyone else because some people don't like it and a few people abuse it.

Bots are not a valid reason either. What happened the moment these came off? We were back to how it was in PSO2 Classic, Bots would just spam in text, and maybe that makes it easier to ban them; but it makes no difference to the player experience. If bots hide in some corner in central city we still have to hunt them down and block them. Also the far more effective measure was the Aina quest thing. This should have been implemented first before killing a system, that ultimately punishes players and detracts from the game because of bots.

Sexual content is slightly valid. First off this only really applies to full nudity, as the game is very sexual in nature, and even emphasizes partial nudity in it's ESRB rating. Where full nudity becomes a problem is the ToS, and breaking it. However, we have a simple solution to that: Reports and bans. --However, I'd argue this isn't completely necessary either. We have a game rated M; and like all online games the expected caveat is that the "Game Experience May Change During Online Play". By analogy just like the people who are able to by bass the censor to make some racist or other offensive joke, or the couple who are ERPing in their personal quarters, and of course those who post fully nude symbol arts; have effectively changed the experience. But this is something adults (M rating remember) should be able to take in stride and easily move on from. People who do not appreciate, wish to condone, or wish to participate can easily block those people on their end. More over; If you are a minor the game doesn't even allow you and others to communicate and we effectively protect them from being exposed. But that is ultimately irrelevant; If they do not want this content simple reports and bans are all you need.

Symbol arts can be degenerate, Anime as a whole can be degenerate as well. But this is the community we have, this is part of anime geek culture, and Sega is complicit for most of the degeneracy; Just look at the emotes like banana boat and the various outfits we get, even their own PSO2 Comi is on par. Plus see how the Japanese version is run. We pretend like global is such a stark difference in attitude and values, but honestly with the exception of playable content; the vast majority of people who enjoy this game will by extension share the same values as any JP player, otherwise most of us wouldn't even play this game. We'd go to FFXIV or WoW or BDO or GW2 or Destiny or Warframe, or wait for a new MMO or looter game. Frankly the people who don't share those values can easily block out the things they don't want to be exposed to, and considering how tiny yet vocal that minority is they could easily move on without looking back, and financially sega; you wouldn't even notice.

Ultimately SA is something special to this game, and gives it such a depth of life that other games do not, it along with a few other systems facilitates social interaction that other games are lacking; and ultimately PSO2 is lesser without it. Like literally anything it can be abused; but that isn't a reason to punish everyone else's freedoms because a few bad apples upset a few other bad apples.

I know it sucks not being able to use SA in area chat anymore, but to say they’ve been removed from the game is an overstatement. Do people not use their alliance or group chats? I still use my SA and see SA pretty heavily.

I'm in favor of this and I hated SA. The toggle option was a fine solution to make everybody happy, it works as long as streamers remember to toggle it off.

I mean it is off by default now so streamers don't even need to remember to toggle it off. But there are just some things I can't express well without the use of area SA. I also want to be able to share all the Io SA I have.

I like the idea of SA but a few bad eggs kind of spoiled the experience for me so I just stopped bothering. I would probably have a million cat meme SA by now if I got into it. The decision doesn't impact me but it should be an option in the player's hands.

For once a wall of text actually made sense and wasn't a massive rant, and yes I agree bring back area chat SAs, just have a better way of monitoring them and more client side controls to toggle as needed. I miss a lot of the SAs that fired off while relaxing in between UQs or farming runs, plus my alliance used SA for recruiting new members. Limiting SAs to alliance, group, and party chats has made NGS feel more empty.

And like you said anything can be abused, I have a huge issue with people who have extremely spammy autochat cut-ins that are set for area chat and go off almost every two seconds. I myself do have some autochat cut-ins, but only on things that go off once or twice, plus the autochat system itself can be fun and useful when set up properly, since you can add to your character's personality with them (my main character uses a bunch of pop-culture and machine references since he is a CAST while my alt uses a bunch of mystic or fox themed references since she is a kitsune).

Also beside autochats being abused, I have had to deal with irritating players spamming the most annoying emote during concerts, I block listed that idiot but it doesn't mute the Space Channel 5 emote.

Seconded, opt in, off by default, shouldn't restrict people who aren't bothered by it.

@TEN-SQUARE-3 said in I don't see any real reason why symbol arts should have been removed, and Sega should bring them back ASAP.:

I know it sucks not being able to use SA in area chat anymore, but to say they’ve been removed from the game is an overstatement. Do people not use their alliance or group chats? I still use my SA and see SA pretty heavily.

It's really not the same. There is a great difference between communicating with the people you have already formed connections with compared to communicating with large groups. This also increases the burden to where if you're chatting in public, you cannot reply or respond to a person with an appropriate symbol art before inviting them to a chat group, and if you are having a 3+ way conversation with one member in your alliance or party; responding with a SA in the hidden area not only loses impact in the conversation but also alienates your other members who are lacking context, or potentially interrupts relevant alliance communication.

Plus there are other situations where in combat a SA may be far more efficient than typing, and it should be communicated to more than just people in your party. Things that come to mind are like Magatsu; and we've lost that functionality all together.

Again it really isn't the same.

They just need to do more than just 're-enable it', then it can come back. If they do it the way I suggested It can come back in the exact same way it use to be with the ability for them (sega) to block all RMT SA from being added at all and separate SA by categories so people can not turn on the category they dont want to see.

but until they do it, they cant just re-enable it.

@Weirdo said in I don't see any real reason why symbol arts should have been removed, and Sega should bring them back ASAP.:

I mean it is off by default now so streamers don't even need to remember to toggle it off. But there are just some things I can't express well without the use of area SA. I also want to be able to share all the Io SA I have.

I don't care for SA even remotely.

But you had me at Io.

I really do miss area SAs. I loved being able to express myself with various cat symbols.

A large part of the Pso2 culture I loved, and even what initially got me to play, was exchanging memes, ideas, attitudes, emotions, etc through those images. I have fellow alliance members who are excellent Sa creators who have been seriously put off from playing because of the restrictions to Sa's in area chat.

I did see a surprising amount of sexual content in public SAs, however. But just like with auto-chat, I learned how to disable them myself before they forced the option to auto-block. In some rare cases, I just blocked the player that was using them.

I know that store functionality is not entirely the same as in base Pso2, but one problem I saw a lot of was the use of sexual content as store advertisements. I don't know if the block functionality removed people and their Sa's from store searches when looking for listed items, but I do know that seeing mature content seemed unavoidable when scrolling through posts. If Sega 'improves' or changes store functionality in NGS, making it similar to base Pso2 (being able to search for specific people, etc), then I foresee more issues for streamers and players alike who find those images in store advertisements.

In all, however, I absolutely loved collecting and using Sa's, especially in area chat. Having this restriction is one of myriad reasons I have NOT renewed premium in NGS.

I'm late to the thread because I took a break from the forums. I wanted to chime in because I was very active in sharing info from the forums in game a week prior to SA's being removed. I warned users in game about their symbol art, told them that if they wanted to be allowed to post NSFW art, that they needed to make their voices heard on the forums, as I personally didn't have an issue with it, but knew several on the forums did. That only one side of the isle was being heard, and I said that until the ToS changes that they should share those in a more private setting (bots excluded because they are bots and aren't sentient beings).

I also warned that SA's would be taken away if people weren't smarter about how they were going about this, and I was essentially told to screw off, and was called toxic by many players there, and one dude flat out told me that if they took SA's away, that I could say I told them so later, but otherwise I should just shut up. ( I also mentioned that they should advocate for filtering systems on SA's but again was told to sod off)

Most of those players are gone from the game now, as they started to disappear after their NSFW symbol art got taken away. Yes, they lost interest the same way other players did when losing basic functionality, for their own reasons of course, but a not too dissimilar reason than the rest of the player base.

I was one of a few advocates for a NSFW type filter, and overall settings that would allow players better control over the Symbol art content they were seeing, over their removal (not too dissimilar from a suggestion in the in game suggestion, forum section). So far it's not removed, but you can't share them publicly, and this has only hastened the fall off of players.

I noticed the drastic change two days after it was implemented, and this was the result of people already annoyed with a lack of content, losing a way to entertain themselves, as many were using symbol art as a way to entertain both themselves and others, and it was a major draw to keeping peoples attention. The game feels so wrong without it. The memes are gone, the Io, Quna, Matoi etc symbol arts, the anime related ones, all gone, and it's weird something so simple added so much to the entertainment within the game.

Then again, I can see why it was once considered a staple of it as well. I don't see other games allowing that type of communication format. It's a shame that SEGA hasn't been more transparent with what their plans are, for making this issue, in a sense, resolved to an outcome that the majority would be content with, seeing as when they originally shut them off, they said it was a temporary solution, and yet it's been a while since any info has been shared on it.

RMT aside, the SA's had a list of issues that could only be resopved by a filtration system, but that would take time to make, so maybe thats why no word is out on them being restored. But thats my only guess. The Bots will still be an issue either way though, as they, while an adjacent issue, are entirely separate.

I much more preferred when RMT bots spammed symbol art instead of text messages. Back then all I had to do was open the symbol art history tab and block that specific symbol art. Then after another bot showed up and used the same symbol art it was still blocked. They updated it every now and then, but the effect still lasted longer than having to find and block every single bot individually.

@Browren said in I don't see any real reason why symbol arts should have been removed, and Sega should bring them back ASAP.:

I much more preferred when RMT bots spammed symbol art instead of text messages. Back then all I had to do was open the symbol art history tab and block that specific symbol art. Then after another bot showed up and used the same symbol art it was still blocked. They updated it every now and then, but the effect still lasted longer than having to find and block every single bot individually.

This ^

Exactly this.

SEGA baka