Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?

@KOSMOSFAN22497 oh, it was pretty bad from what i've seen

@Blade-Syphon

Yes i do read what i post you however dont.

Your concept only works if there is only ONE timeline in ONE dimension. When Persona entered our timeline the loop was already broken there was no loop anymore. Persona was not a part of our timeline he was not affected by its rules and he didnt play by the rules. In his original timeline what you say is true yes but as soon as he enters other timelines he is not a part of said loop anymore he is a so called "outside factor". So thanks for proving that you have no clue about dimensional time travel just like i assumed.

@Riesz

In the time travel option we dont replace Ethan at all. We just travel back in time to prevent him from maybe doing something affecting the future. Or we find out by following him around that he iisnt responsible for the future at all who know. That means our PC does not even have any form of contact with Ethan at all.

Also i remember using a picture as prove from your own post against your own theory and i was never proven wrong by you. Also no one ever proved me wrong when i said we are just the protagonist in our dimension and that there maybe is a dimension with Ash as us. As i said before Ash is pretty much Segas PC.

So yeah what you guys say only works if we were the original dimension and timeline however good luck proving that.

So we’re literally watching a game being made from bad decisions? oof 😕

@Gilver-Redgrave said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

You know what is funny ? I watched Anamanas YT video yesterday and he really said that Universe had more content on release then NGS. So i wonder who i should trust now on the content argument. Maybe you remember it wrong ? Because i know he did play it last year ago again so his memorys are fresh.

Before responding I must point out I never said Universe released with less content than NGS, just that its release was not episodic. Universe released in October 2006. The first chapter of Episode 2 didn't arrive until December 2006 (6½ weeks after launch) and the final chapter of Episode 2 didn't happen until September 2007, almost a year later. That's not episodic, so what I said was demonstrably correct.

I must also point out that your claim was "Sega can release it in Episodes like PSO2". PSO2. Not New Genesis. New Genesis didn't even enter into it, and I hadn't mentioned New Genesis at all in this sub-discussion prior to your post here. You're trying to move the goalposts.

Temporary diversion start

Whether Universe or NGS launched with "more content" is mostly but not entirely subjective. The exception is the story; unless you include Episode 1 which was not available in Network Mode at all, it is an objective fact that Universe's Network Mode had less story than New Genesis because the former didn't have any on launch.

Beyond that though it's a matter of what you consider more important; Universe had a higher level cap (50 vs 20), weapon types (17 vs 12), equipment tiers (5 vs 4) and lore locations (all but Moatoob which arrived in November 2006, vs at least two locked regions). New Genesis has more classes (6 vs 3) and adventuring environments (7 vs 6). Bosses aren't a like-for-like because Universe has no equivalent for veteran enemies or PSE Burst Climax bosses; if you ignore those Universe had more (3 vs 2 UQs) but if you include Nogleth, Waulon, Vanas, Oruq, Nex Aelio, the Daityl family and so on New Genesis has way more. Cosmetics are also a difficult comparison because Universe had a relatively small amount in its town shops with a fixed set of colours and no accessories.

I can understand why anyone would say either Universe or New Genesis had "more content" at launch. Personally wouldn't say either.

Temporary diversion end

Back to the point you've been trying to deflect from though, you claimed that a Universe remaster could be launched "in Episodes like PSO2". Which PSO2 never did, and if Universe did launch like PSO2 it definitely wouldn't have Moatoob. Universe that launched like Universe didn't have Moatoob, and PSO2 JP was not a faster pace than Universe. In order for Universe to not be considered as lacking content, it would have to accelerate its launch content to have most if not all of what was added post-launch, and if you do that you are not comparing like-for-like anymore.


@Gilver-Redgrave said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Matoi in the last cutscene tells us that she "loves" us indicating the protagonist is in fact male.

@Weirdo said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Gender isn't really evidence since you can have same sex relationships.

To extend this a bit further, I think one of the Episode 4 cutscenes has Matoi react differently to Hitsugi questioning her interest in the Guardian depending on their gender, but either way she gets cliché flustered and stuff. I could be wrong about this though.


@Riesz said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

In none of the PSO2 openings does he use the coated arms

The 7th opening (for Episode 6) does have Ash wielding Coated Edge. Openings aren't really relatable to PSO2 canon though as the only named characters that appear in those are Falz Hyunal (Elder), Falz Apprentice (Euclyta) and Magatsu.

The openings kind of have their own independent loose continuity considering the recurring appearances of several character-creation template characters which feels mostly designed to show them as placeholders for our custom characters to take the place of. It's a bit of a weird situation really!


@Blade-Syphon said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Again - look at my comparison to PSU with Final Fantasy VII, or any story-based JRPG for that matter. You cannot simply slap your character in over an established protagonist, and expect the same results.

I'm not honestly sure this comparison explains it best. You could technically slot in a different character in place of Cloud, who does evrything the same as Cloud and has the same backstory as Cloud, and the original plot of Final Fantasy VII would be left completely intact.

This is impossible in Universe; Ethan and the player character are canonically different characters that must be kept separate for story integrity because at several points during the story they both make concurrent progress that converges later on.

If the game ended by Epsiode 2 it might be possible to eliminate the player character from canon and treat all their actions as having been done by Laia, but even that isn't possible as Episode 3 similarly has Laia and the player character making concurrent separate progress (if I remember the player character is called Commander by that point). Between the three episodes, the player character is canonically their own entity separate to all named characters.

The only way to fit Episode 1 into a custom-character format without dramatically altering the story would be to have them be a friend of Ethan's who helps him out during Chapter 1 and joins the GUARDIANS alongside him. But that would be immersion-breakingly tenuous. Separate to Episode 1, the stories of Portable, Portable 2 and Infinity would need to be backported out of PSP jail and I think some of those had non-custom player characters that'd need to be reworked as well.

Even maintaining the Network Mode story of Universe alone and as-is would be tricky; the reason for Ethan's suddenly divergent role throughout Episode 2 was only explained in a web story series called Shadow of the Arkguard that'd need to be recreated or retold as well. If that was in-game it'd need to be merged with Episode 2 and since there's no place for a player character in that either it would either need a non-linear presentation to preserve the mystery or to be cut up and slotted in before and during Episode 2 which (if the player character was shoe-horned into those scenes) eliminates the mystery of the player character not knowing what's up with Ethan.

@Miraglyth

Well to be fair this never was a like-for-like comparison to begin with. We compare a Dungeon Crawler with Open World here. So like-for-like is out the window right from the start.

@Gilver-Redgrave said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Well to be fair this never was a like-for-like comparison to begin with. We compare a Dungeon Crawler with Open World here. So like-for-like is out the window right from the start.

So what you're saying is this

@Gilver-Redgrave said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

If PSU would be remastered as a full Online Game like PSO2 with some changes so that the multiplayer is needed and rewarded those 250k would be broken on day one in just 1 hour.

was a non-point all along?

@KOSMOSFAN22497 The sad thing is they made a decent enough story for the game too but they sold it as a separate book instead of actually including any dialogue in the game to understand what's going on.

@Miraglyth No.

Your like-for-like argument was. 😉

If a Dungeon Crawler on Release gets more players then some Open World MMO then thats clearly indicating something. Dungeon Crawlers are in a disantvantage so like-for-like aint possible.Thats why i never understood your argument because i am starting from a disantvantage position

I mean just compare the content PSO2 got in 10 years......and then watch WoW or Silkroad or any other Open World game with the same lifespan.(or what they had at that point) Would you say that is "like-for-like" ?

Did PSU really start with an online level cap of 50? I feel like it was much lower than that.

@Riesz said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

@KOSMOSFAN22497 The sad thing is they made a decent enough story for the game too but they sold it as a separate book instead of actually including any dialogue in the game to understand what's going on.

There's a book?...

Yeah I'm a tad confused on how Matoi saying she loves you means you're canonically male. And yeah @Miraglyth the game does differentiate depending on what sex your character is

a quick side note: how can phantasy star 0 be set on coral 100 years after pso1 when in the original pso one of the scientist guys you talk to when you first materialise in the principal's office confirmed that coral was going to pull a krypton(blow up) by saying"our home planet was tearing itself apart, we couldn't stop it"

@KOSMOSFAN22497 Yup Balan has a book called "Balan Wonderworld ~Maestro of Mystery, Theatre of Wonders~"