Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?

@TURION-MOONSTAR said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

@Miraglyth phantasy star universe was a good game so clearly the man knew what he was doing

Not good enough to keep the servers open. This feels like the same response the diehard fans of Wildstar gave.

@Gilver-Redgrave

What the hell did I just read?

No, you do any of that, and you no longer have a remastered Phantasy Star Universe, you have an entirely different game set in a heavily altered version of PSU's universe. In other words - you have a FFVII Remake scenario, and I don't think anyone really wants another one of those crawling around.

I'm honest to god starting to think you've never even played any of the PSU games. Your nonsensical ramblings basically tell me you have literally no understanding, what so ever, of PSU's plot, of what an established character is, or how you can't simply super impose your own PC into that role and have it still make narrative sense.

Again - look at my comparison to PSU with Final Fantasy VII, or any story-based JRPG for that matter. You cannot simply slap your character in over an established protagonist, and expect the same results. And your non-sensical ramblings about time traveling nonsense would only further complicate and dilute the plot. The PC in PSU does not have a role in Episode 1, they're not yet a Guardian. It's not until Episode 2, where the PC becomes a Guardian under the tutleage of Leia, do they even begin to make waves in the PSU storyline.

Episode 1 is Ethan's story, and it's designed as such in order to set the entire foundation for the storylines to follow. You remove Ethan, and you remove the entire plot of PSU. And no, some fan-fiction level of writing about time travel does not "Fix" the problem, it makes it worst, and turns a remastered PSU into something else entirely

PSU existed as an ofline single player JRPG coupled with an ORPG multiplayer mode that, canonically, takes place after the events of the aformtioned single player mode. A remastered PSU would have zero reasons to change that. All you're basically doing is trying to make PSU into an entirely different game for..reasons I can't even begin to fathom.

And for the last bloody time - Ash is not the canonical protagonist of PSO2 - the Guardian is. Ash is the default stand in generic character model that's used in place of the PC's Guardian because it would literally be impossible for Sega to render the player's character in anything other than the in-game cinematics.

No one who plays Final Fantasy XIV tries to argue that the Derplander is the canonical protagonist, because he's not. He's the stand in for the player's Warrior of Light, who can be anything from a female Miqo'te, to a big 'ole bulky Roedaygn male. And the Derplander of XIV is literally the same thing as the Ash of PSO2.

I don't understand why you're struggling so hard to come to terms with this concept.

@Blade-Syphon

sigh

I already gave one option how it can be done and no it would not turn into a different game. If you have a problem with small changes then that is your problem tbh. But saying that its not possible is a flat out lie nothing more.

And Ash is the canon protagonist. I even explined it extremely easy to understand when i said Ash is Segas PC. If you cant understand something as simple as that then thats your fault. Youre not even able to debunk the examples i gave why Ash is the canonical protagonist and we are just the alternate version of his timeline.

I don't understand why you're struggling so hard to come to terms with this concept. Even tho the whole game is about time travel and alternate dimensions.

@Blade-Syphon said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

@Gilver-Redgrave

What the hell did I just read?

No, you do any of that, and you no longer have a remastered Phantasy Star Universe, you have an entirely different game set in a heavily altered version of PSU's universe. In other words - you have a FFVII Remake scenario, and I don't think anyone really wants another one of those crawling around.

I found this odd as Remake was a very good game and did very well. So who is this "anyone" youre talking about. Also I do think the ffxiv protag has a bit more going for him than Ash does. Theres a few more points leading to him not just being the stand in. But in general the WoL is whoever

@Gilver-Redgrave

Because you're wrong, it's as simple as that. You've been proven wrong, by multiple people, multiple times, in this thread, yet you refuse to acknowledge that.

I don't really know what else to say, other than you have a very clear misunderstanding of how a narrative works, how a protagonist works, and why nothing in any of your nonsensical ramblings made even a lick of sense in relation to a remaster of PSU.

And there was nothing about time travel in PSU, at all. I really am starting to think you've never even played Phantasy Star Universe at this point. Time Travel isn't even used in the way you're thinking in PSO2 either - It's used in a paradoxal manner, creating an infinite loop that causes the same events to occur over and over ad-infitium, with some characters having the ability to adjust small portions, or bare witness to, parts of this time loop via the Akashi Records, but there's no actual "I'm going to step into my time machine and travel back in time to change the events of the past to make a brighter future" ala Chrono Trigger, or what you're suggesting in you're "remaster" of PSU.

If anything, PSO2's got more in common with a plot like Chrono Cross, than it does Trigger, when it comes to affecting key points in a timeline to create branching dimensions and outcomes.

@XenoBladeX37645 said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

I found this odd as Remake was a very good game and did very well. So who is this "anyone" youre talking about.

It depends on who you talk to, honestly. I personally had no problems with Remake, but there's no denying that there were, and still are, a lot of unhappy people out there that wanted a remake of FFVII, and instead got a sequel, which is more of what I was referring too. That's not to say PSU was in any way near as popular as FFVII, but for those that did love it, I imagine they'd want a remaster of the original game, not some bastardization of the plot involving time travel and whatever other nonsense Gilver tried to retcon into what could best be described a fanfiction levels of writing.

@XenoBladeX37645 said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Also I do think the ffxiv protag has a bit more going for him than Ash does. Theres a few more points leading to him not just being the stand in. But in general the WoL is whoever

Not really. You're probably referring to Ardbert, the Warrior of Light from the world of Norvrandt, the setting of Shadowbringers. That's an entirely different character from the Derplander of XIV's cinematics, SE basically just used his model (and the models of the other Norvrand WoL's for that matter) as a nod to ARR's original opening cinematic, where they were all featured. Ardbert is not, however, the cinematic standin Hyur Highlander that shows up in all of XIV's promotional material.

SE has gone out on record say that the canon protagonist of XIV is the player's Warrior of Light, so no, Ash and good old Derplander are perfect comparisons to use.

@Blade-Syphon

No one proved me wrong by now thats just you believing things. Just like you believe that i said PSU had something to do with time travel. I never said that thats you twisting your own words around so it makes sense for you. I said the Remaster could feature it so the MMO makes sense thats a huge difference.

Also you just proved you have no idea how PSO2 time travel works.Here some facts:

  • Persona visited multiple timelines/dimensions and alsways had the same result until in our timeline/dimension Matoi survived. So its NOT the same loop anymore.
  • We sealed the Primordial Darkness breaking the loop. Hence our timeline got changed.
  • We also had multiple events changing the loop resulting in us ending it. Mostly Personas interference in a dimensional timeline he is not a part of.

Xiao even said when he send us back in time that we need to be carefull because everything we do or say could affect the present so i rather believe Xiao then you on this one. And Persona even proved that because our timeline changed because of him because he traveled back in time. As i said before there isnt just time travel but dimension travel aswell and once someone or something from another dimension comes to ours that said being IS NOT part of the loop and can change it. That was the whole purpose of Persona....sad you didnt realize that.

For you it sounds like nonsensical rambling but thats you not understanding how things work so thats not my fault.

Yuji Naka needs to come back to SEGA and save his baby.

Or kill it himself.

@Kofi9867

I would prefer the former.

@Gilver-Redgrave said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

@Blade-Syphon

No one proved me wrong

Yes we did you just refuse to listen.

@Gilver-Redgrave said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Persona visited multiple timelines/dimensions and alsways had the same result until in our timeline/dimension Matoi survived. So its NOT the same loop anymore. We sealed the Primordial Darkness breaking the loop. Hence our timeline got changed. We also had multiple events changing the loop resulting in us ending it. Mostly Personas interference in a dimensional timeline he is not a part of.

Jesus do you even read what you post before you post it?

You literally just explained what a closed time loop is. Yes, what Persona was doing was trying to change a time loop that could not be changed because it was caught in a paradox of Persona being the Guardian that, in attempting to prevent Matoi from becoming the Profound Darkness, would lead to the events that would force her to become the Profound Darkness. That is, by the very definition, a closed time loop.

And no shit we closed the time loop - that was the entire point of the Episode 6's plot - defying fate and proving that we are masters of our own destiny. I never said the time loop was permanent, it's just that the plot of PSO2 was around what was perceived to be an impossible to alter time loop created at the beginning of time by the Akashic Records.

I.. I'm not even going to bother anymore. You have literally no idea what it is you're typing, fail to understand even the most basic of understanding of plots, and leap from one tangent to another the moment you're proven wrong in hopes that no one pays any notice to your complete and total lack of understanding of everything you're pretending to be knowledgeable about.

Just...stop. You have no idea what you're talking about. You have no concept of Phantasy Star Universe's plot, you have no concept of what Ash is supposed to be, or why Sega uses him as a generic stand in to our Guardians, and you have no idea what a paradox or time loop is.

Thankfully, there are powers in place to prevent people such as yourself from ever laying a hand on video games, so we atleast have that going for us.

@Gilver-Redgrave said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Just like you believe that i said PSU had something to do with time travel. I never said that thats you twisting your own words around so it makes sense for you. I said the Remaster could feature it so the MMO makes sense thats a huge difference.

And yet...

@Gilver-Redgrave said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

I don't understand why you're struggling so hard to come to terms with this concept. Even tho the whole game is about time travel and alternate dimensions.

So what's this in context of? I never mentioned time travel as part of PSO2's plot, I mentioned it as you writing what essentially amounted to as terrible fan fiction by shoving time travel crap into Phantasy Star Universe, where it never existed, and doesn't need to exist. Or are we going to pretend now that you didn't type that you'd "Fix" EPisode 1's story by self inserting the PC into the plot through the machinations of time travel, even though that makes literally no sense, and would exist in a universe where time travel doesn't exist, just because...why exactly? You don't like the idea of Ethan being the protagonist of Episode 1, which was created FROM THE BEGINNING to be a single player JRPG as a throw back to the Genesis era of Phatnasy Star?

Either learn to format your posts better and actually put your thoughts into a better laid out fashion so we can grasp what your incoherent rambling is about, or stop trying to pretend you're not typing things that you are, in fact, typing.

@Blade-Syphon While I don't agree with that person's theories or how he would decide to make a player character replace Ethan, I do think there is a way to make it work, basically they could make it that your character is Ethan in every way except appearance (having people refer to him as Ethan, having him speak still (but obviously not use any custom voices your character might have), having the same backstory but having him take your custom character's appearance if male, and making a Female character that also has the same things just with a different name and voice actor).

That wouldn't really take away from him being the same character, because all it would really be changing would be the appearance (and name too if female). There are rpgs that do that (like the Mass Effect series being one of the best examples, your choices affect the story but other than who you can form romantic relationships with being based on the gender, what your character looks like isn't very relevant to the story, you're still the same character as the default appearance Commander Shepard that made the same choices).

@Kofi9867 said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Yuji Naka needs to come back to SEGA and save his baby.

Or kill it himself.

After Balan, it would surely be a swift end.

@Riesz That just would not work, because there's already a player character in the PSU story, which is introduced in Episode 2.

If you were to take only Episode 1 out of context, sure, maybe you could replace Ethan with a custom character, but then what about everything that happens after Episode 1? In Episode 2 and 3 both Ethan and the player character play separate key roles, you just can't merge both into a single character.

Then there's the sequels to PSU, Portable 2 and Portable 2 Infinity, where Ethan still appears, but, he's not a main character anymore. In these there's also a completely new player character that is unrelated to the PSU one.

Though, this whole discussion about PSU doesn't really matter much, it's a game that was far less popular than PSO2 (independently of the quality of both PSU and PSO2), if any Phantasy Star game were to be remade in the future, PSO1 or the classic games are what most players would want, not PSU (not that I wouldn't like the Universe series to be remastered, personally I would like a remastered collection with everything from the Universe series, even including the gameplay enhancements from Portable 2 Infinity in the older games, but it's just not going to happen).

@Riesz said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

While I don't agree with that person's theories or how he would decide to make a player character replace Ethan, I do think there is a way to make it work, basically they could make it that your character is Ethan in every way except appearance (having people refer to him as Ethan, having him speak still (but obviously not use any custom voices your character might have), having the same backstory but having him take your custom character's appearance if male, and making a Female character that also has the same things just with a different name and voice actor).

The problem however, then, is how do you handle Episode 2 and 3, when Ethan goes "rogue", and the story perspective shifts over to the Guardian PC. You'd basically make a PC Ethan, then have said character taken away from you, and be told to make a NEW PC to take the role of the protagonist for Episode 2 and 3.

Now, if you want to go the Commander Shepard route, and give the player some basic customization features for Ethan, that's totally fair. But again - Ethan himself is integral to the actual plot of PSU. You can't simply remove or replace him with the PC, and have the following Episodes still function the same narritively. In the case of Episode 1, you simply can't remove Ethan without creating a cascade effect that throws the rest of the game's narrative into the wood work.

And even with an example of Shepard, Bioware was pretty strict on how much you could actually customize his apperance, because while they did want to give you some freedom to make Shepard "yours", Shepard is, in the end, a pre-defined character, just as Ethan was.

@Aumires said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

@Kofi9867 said in Why does it feel like the NGS director wants to kill the series?:

Yuji Naka needs to come back to SEGA and save his baby.

Or kill it himself.

After Balan, it would surely be a swift end.

Ouch....Was Balan really that bad?..