Important topic that is being overlooked and derailed too much.

maybe if you learned it more fluently and read more, you'd understand. since you don't theres no point continuing this, since you lack the basic experience to understand the arguments.

Mind proving that this is true? Or are you just going to assert this?

Pretty funny that you'd jump to asserting that I have 0 credibility instead of providing proof when requested.

How can I prove something to someone who clearly does not understand the basic concepts required to understand such proof? Maybe go read some stories about characters? that's as close to as much help as I can offer. it's pointless to try to get through to someone who lacks the basic knowledge that used to be expected of anyone who's lived a couple decades about literature and writing in the english language.

I can't prove something that you either cannot or refuse to understand.

So, I instead challenge you to prove your point to me. becuase really the burden of proof lies on the one making the more absurd claims, challenging a norm that has already existed for centuries.

Keep talking about supposed English on a Japanese made game... At least personally I expect Japanese games to not try to conform/pay too much mind to another countries norms/culture etc. Since it being a Japanese game is one of the reasons I play it and sure I'm not alone in that.

Obviously that is pretty abundantly clear in regards to Anime in general(what people tend to expect).

If anything sure, of course not against PSO2 devs making a toggleable option to implement it*, but otherwise I'm a "NO CHANGES" kind of person with me Japanese stuff.

*If actually that many people bothered by it, so they can turn that option on. (as in only they see the change etc)

I can't prove something that you either cannot or refuse to understand.

I cannot fail or refuse to understand something that has not even been presented in the first place.

So, I instead challenge you to prove your point to me. becuase really the burden of proof lies on the one making the more absurd claims, challenging a norm that has already existed for centuries.

Ah, yes, my point of "Organic dialogue and proper grammar can exist without pronouns or with they/them".

  • Using they/them in the place of he/she is proper grammar. They are all pronouns, and they is gender neutral, so it's use will cause no issue.
  • The use of they/them in the place of he/she is organic. Their use does not make dialogue unrealistic, inhuman, or unbelievable - unless you believe that their use for this purpose is something that does not happen. Then you would be very wrong.

ಠ_ಠ

/10char

Idk, I live in California, and I don't think I've heard he/she used in like 3 months. I wouldn't doubt that ~1000 years into the future the whole world doesn't use gendered pronouns.

@Kyrosu "Japanese made game should not take english into consideration" a valid argument IF PSO2 WAS STILL A GAME RELEASED OFFICIALLY ONLY IN JAPAN.

The fact there -is- a localization means it is a factor like any american made game.

@Moei lol... you clearly don't have friends, family, or any social connections. it's in the daily lexicon of every community in the world.

If someone does not wish to be called by the standard he or she, that's fine, don't, but He and She are standard and important vocabulary words with important and objectively relevant meanings.

@ZeeHero9271 Yeah the pandemic kind of does that. No, since the pandemic I have lived in a bubble of people who ask what your gender is, before assuming it based on outward presentation(work/friends). After awhile everyone got lazy, stopped asking for pronoun preferences, and started just using they/them.

It is actually pretty cool, and I don't see any reason not to normalize it. Means I don't have to remember people's gender either, which actually allowed me to be even lazier than before.

I actually think gender is a fairly personal thing, no reason to share it by default like he/she makes you.

Its being overlooked because its not important. Ill never understand this "need" people have to be represented in the media people consume to a T.

@LusterMain said in Important topic that is being overlooked and derailed too much.:

Or it could just be written so that no pronouns are used in the first place. Or it could just use they/them in place of he/she.

Unless someone has a screenshot/video where anything relevant to this happened in the CBT, the game is ~ 9 hours from launch now, and it would be better to wait to see what SEGA did about it than discuss it now.

I've seen two occasions in PSO2 where the player character was referred to with male pronouns instead of gender-neutral pronouns (which is the usual use) or female pronouns (my character is female).

I would say that it's mostly an impossibility because of voice acting. Kinda like how the 3D remake of FFIV removed the option to change character names because of the voice acting in cutscenes. When it came to dialogue og PSO2 always went out of its way to not use pronouns when refering to the player because of this, either calling by a title, your name, or just skipping the part when it came to talking, so I would assume it's the same case for NGS. JP doesn't have this problem because they have pronouns that are neutral.

You could argue that it can be used when talking to the NPCs on the field, but most of the time they refer to the player in a personal level (using "You") which kinda defeats the purpose of customized pronouns. The most plausible solution would be using "they/them" like LusterMain said, as they're also gender-neutral pronouns in the English lenguage, or just keep it as it is avoiding the use of pronouns.

Not really. Voice acting has a long history of saying one thing while the text says the actual name or pronoun. not to mention FFXIV voice acting has both he and she words premade, the appropriate one for the PC's gender is automatically selected.

Why are people arguing on the premise that avoiding pronouns is a thing? its not a thing in any of the dozens and dozens of story based online and offline games I've played.

Obviously if they dont assume that people already do this all the time their argument is completely gone but.. cmon can we please open our eyes to reality around us and not debate whats already fact?

@ZeeHero9271 said in Important topic that is being overlooked and derailed too much.:

Not really. Voice acting has a long history of saying one thing while the text says the actual name or pronoun. not to mention FFXIV voice acting has both he and she words premade, the appropriate one for the PC's gender is automatically selected.

Yeah, PSO2 does this too. For example, using "Guardian" in voice while the subtitles used the protagonist's name, or "You two" when the subtitles used "<protagonist's name> and Matoi".