NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion

That’s why they need to give us more tools to tag and moderate stuff ourselves, I like seeing NSFW stuff as much as the next person, but from a business standpoint having to wait until many customers are turned away from product negligence is a pretty bad move on their part. 😕

@Anarchy-Marine said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

@PotatoSolo1 As another player stated, NSFW symbol arts arent allowed. That said, whenever one gets removed, three more pop up, and banning players that support the game, because they like said art, isn't the solution either. One of the other posts here mentions an auto flagging system that blocks that type of art for people who don't want to see it, as a better option. That option folds right into another topic, several in fact on these forums that revolve around censorship, all of which are locked due to heated arguments. The only thing anyone agreed on, that would have been fair, was a toggle system that would allow such a system as that flagging for certain symbol arts to be on by default, which would also be good for streamers, live streaming the game on say Twitch, and anyone that doesn't want to see certain mature content, to be able to turn aspects of said system on or off based on personal choice.

Such a system would allow players on the opposite end of that fence to play how they want, mature content and all, provided that it's permitted by the ToS, and the GM's at large. SA's would probably still need to be moderated, but not as much, and the focus could then be moved off of adult symbol arts, hypothetically, and focus and resources could be shifted to people causing real problems in game, like threatening other players, harassment, and those bots that are to this day still block hopping trying to RMT meseta. At any rate, that's not something easily done, and likely won't happen for some time, given NGS's launch schedule, and SEGA's current timeline and plans. To this day I think it's a good idea, but I'm not even sure such an idea has even reached SEGA's ear.

I know what they said I just wish to help solve the problem on the long run as better graphics attract a broader player base. Plus the game has a lot of potential IMO.

@Pariah-Chan said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

Unless the stamps are supposed to replace symbol arts in NGS, the NSFW stuff needs to be moderated a bit more differently.

There needs to be a new setting turned on by default that hides NFSW arts, and a feature to tag an art as NSFW. Since a symbol art has a specific ID linked to it, just one person tagging it as NSFW would hide it across all players.

Agreed

@Drayco84 said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

I just want to ask one thing here... WHY aren't NSFW Symbol Arts allowed in my M-Rated MMO? It's pretty stupid to disallow something like that on an M-Rated or even ban players from making them when the age rating is so high to begin with. (But then, maybe they shouldn't be adding pointless virtual casinos in a Phantasy Star game. You all know I'm right, the casino was easily the emptiest place in the game. The only game that was really interesting was Mesetan Shooter, and needed multiple people to get the most of it.) In fact, the censored/cut JP scenes got kinda spicy as well, due to the fact that they were bath scenes. (But really, they were no worse than most anime with the same sub-plot.)

Furthermore, it'd be incredibly dumb to ban players because they made NSFW symbol arts, and some of them were really good/funny. The best option would be a tagging system where SAs can be marked as SFW or NSFW, with SFW set as default and the option to flag NSFW SAs as such to cut down on trolling attempts. As previously said, streamers and youtubers would LOVE this kind of feature, and younger players get protected from the reason why EVERYBODY exists. Meanwhile, the crasser/thirstier people get their raunchier content because, again, it's on the internet and features user-made content. Porn WILL appear, regardless of Sega's best efforts. (See those damn RMT spammers that never shut up and constantly change the text JUST ENOUGH to avoid the automated systems for proof.) Overall, their best bet is to have a system that lets the decent players moderate things since the devs will be focusing most of their effort on the game itself and playing whack-a-mole is very time-consuming.

Also true and another angle to look at it, that's also why I suggested x and y chat so you can agree if something like that is posted I don`t judge LOL. Just want to help ease the shock on potential new players that will probably be spooked like I was. 🙂

Thank your for adding to the discussion everyone 🙂

@Pariah-Chan said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

Unless the stamps are supposed to replace symbol arts in NGS, the NSFW stuff needs to be moderated a bit more differently.

There needs to be a new setting turned on by default that hides NFSW arts, and a feature to tag an art as NSFW. Since a symbol art has a specific ID linked to it, just one person tagging it as NSFW would hide it across all players.

Not gonna lie when I say that Stamps are more financially friendly for SEGA than purchasing a NSFW image detecting program that Blade and Soul used last time I played.

(I honestly don't even know if it worked as intended, because some images still stood for a few days.)

We could very well see a graduation from Symbol Art if this irresponsibility continues.

@MasterDarkwingz said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

@Pariah-Chan said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

Unless the stamps are supposed to replace symbol arts in NGS, the NSFW stuff needs to be moderated a bit more differently.

There needs to be a new setting turned on by default that hides NFSW arts, and a feature to tag an art as NSFW. Since a symbol art has a specific ID linked to it, just one person tagging it as NSFW would hide it across all players.

Not gonna lie when I say that Stamps are more financially friendly for SEGA than purchasing a NSFW image detecting program that Blade and Soul used last time I played.

(I honestly don't even know if it worked as intended, because some images still stood for a few days.)

We could very well see a graduation from Symbol Art if this irresponsibility continues.

Or at the very least, players that want to share this stuff do so in private. That way, at least until a better method of filtration gets implemented, if ever, players that are uncomfortable don't have to see it, and Twitch streamers don't have to have SA's turned off all the time. Some of the meme ones are gold, and deserve to be showcased.

@coldreactive said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

explaining the risks since the game is 18+

The GMs don't allow NSFW Symbol Arts. You can report each player that uses them. (You need to know the time and date as well as the character name/player ID.)

Time, date, screenshots, player ID and username and THEN they will tell you they're looking into it but can't tell you anything else.

Then you log back into the game and see the same person there still doing it the next day, and the one after that, etc.

I like lewds as much as anyone else, but I'm not going to post it in an online game just to shock some strangers/for attention in general.

The GM's need to take a harder stance on people posting NSFW symbol arts in public chat, or rather, actually take one in the first place.

My personal suggestion, hand curation to permit symbol arts visible to those with a 'Safe' setting ticked on. What do I mean by hand curation? When making the symbol art, it will not be visible to those with the 'Safe' setting ticked, until it has been approved by whomever does the curation.

How do you submit for the curation? Check a box when saving the SA. Since we have the ability to copy SA's from one slot to another, this could be a mild inconvenience when updating SA's, but generally would be suitable to allow free expression, while still allowing people that stream and otherwise don't want to see an obvious small child in a nsfw situation just suddenly pop up on screen.

This would not free people that use those explicit SA's from being banned, as they could still be reported by other players for using such SA's. But the 'safe' filter would be there as a filter to permit people to use Symbol Arts without the worry of explicit SA's popping up 50+ times during concerts or while passing through a crowd for 5sec.

@RpiesSPIES Good idea really, just requires a bit of effort on Sega

@RpiesSPIES That would require a significant effort on Sega's part, especially considering how many would potentially be submitted in a single day, especially whenever someone updates one. Also it'd require messing with the game coding to implement such a feature. If it were implemented there would be a lengthy wait time as they're all looked over to ensure they actually fit the classification.

The simplest way to go about this would be to enact harsher consequences for those abusing SA's, since potentially getting your account banned and losing all of your cosmetics. Not to mention the FOMO model Sega runs with for PSO2 would be a huge deterrent. They would need to set precise guidelines for what is and is not allowed (no visible genitalia/heavily implied nudity, no promoting hateful messages (eg: nazi swastika, homo/trans/etc.-phobic language or imagery, no racist messages/imagery) ) and stick to them.

The downside of course would be that it would be reactive in nature, but it's the only realistic solution, as it'd require the least amount of fiddling with the game code. It also would be vulnerable to being overwhelmed by reports, such as I stated with your suggestion, with the main thing my idea has in reducing the workload would be deterrence which could backfire if banned users can bypass IP bans and make new accounts easily.

@IAMCRAIG said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

The simplest way to go about this would be to enact harsher consequences for those abusing SA's, since potentially getting your account banned and losing all of your cosmetics.

And that could quite possibly mean that they lose a paying customer. Unsurprisingly, nothing will be done about reports as long as that's true.

@Yggranya Hah, too true. It's kind of disgusting how Sega is touted as being very LGBTQ+ inclusive, especially in Japan, but nothing is being done about the toxic environment they're letting fester and grow, for pretty much the reason you gave.

@IAMCRAIG said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

@RpiesSPIES That would require a significant effort on Sega's part, especially considering how many would potentially be submitted in a single day, especially whenever someone updates one.

They could hire me for it :)))

Also, when the stakes of the matter are 'people literally cannot use this feature with the risk of being banned from streaming platforms for the use of a core feature (and may extend to the a ban on the game itself),' then I feel it's a pretty worthwhile implementation (Plus they could also have people leave the service altogether. people don't want to see children in nsfw situations in their games). Also, it's highly doubtful that someone would be updating and requesting clearance enough times in a single day/week to overload the system. Having it curated would be a thing you do when you're done. You're not just gonna keep making singular changes, and then requesting verification, having it approved, change one thing again, resubmit, and repeat. That's a huge exaggeration on your part.

The rate people would be submitting SA's for this would be high early on, but would slow down over time. Saying 'no, because it'll take too long' is a bad excuse, when the implementation of the system wouldn't really take that long and would barely touch existing code.

Harsher punishments wouldn't do s*. Especially when someone could say 'it was an accident,' as they DO happen if you accidentally double click when skimming SA's to block/report/etc. And they won't ban someone for an accident, bet.

They would definitely do something about it if multiple of their streaming partners encountered NSFW SA on NGS. I wouldn’t put it past them to disable arts and expect us to buy stamps for now on after an incident like that. XD

@Pariah-Chan said in NSFW Content on symbol art "solution?" Discussion:

They would definitely do something about it if multiple of their streaming partners encountered NSFW SA on NGS. I wouldn’t put it past them to disable arts and expect us to buy stamps for now on after an incident like that. XD

What's sad about this is, from what I see in game at least, not everyone that partakes ins such SA related behaviour, does so publicly. Its a minority that does, and that minority that thinks they are funny will just ruin everyone else's fun. Be it the meme creators, the real artists that create cute, funny, or cool anime related stuff, and even those that privately share NSFW stuff, for whatever their reasons. There's always someone in every community like this, and it irritates me to no end. They are always selfish individuals, because as long as they get their laughs in, they don't care about anyone else.

Yeah I see very few people that do it, just a few specific people.

Hmm, if they actually did allow users to tag their own art as NSFW, and then allowed people to filter it based on that tag, then they should have a semi decent noisy dataset that could be used to train an AI to mark images as NSFW, without spending too much money.