PSO2: NGS Rare Drops

Rare stuff is fine, but insanely rare bullshit like S6: Lucent Domain which have very few drop locations and have me on 500+ runs of Crimson Spark Triggers and god knows how many runs of Final Lament without getting it and no way to deterministically get it, or any other possible locations for it to drop? That's not fine.

Goes back to what @Matt said about valuable drops in very little content. It should be in more content so you aren't spending 50 hours doing the same monotonous stuff over and over again, especially when you want people to join for it. That just leads to burnout, which is kind of what's happening to me with this S6. Doesn't help that none of the new content drops it, either.

I mean, PSO2 does still have the rare drop chase, it's just done for Units and Augments, now, rather than weapons, which I agree kind of takes the fun out of it. It's a great feeling when you do finally get that Augment you're hunting for, or Primordial does finally drop a Klaus-series Unit, but I do agree - one of the fun aspects of PSO, and even PSU, was going after specific weapons, which doesn't really exist in PSO2.

Though the developers did say they're dialing that back with NGS, and making weapons individually more important than the augments they have on them, which should probably bring the game back in line with chasing weapons, rather than Augments.

@Blade-Syphon said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

Though the developers did say they're dialing that back with NGS, and making weapons individually more important than the augments they have on them, which should probably bring the game back in line with chasing weapons, rather than Augments.

Did they? Because in CBT2, I felt the opposite. One of the best augments you could get was from Gigantix. But then again, a lot of the affixes are target farmable, so I guess in a way that's true.

Then again, they haven't implemented the first NGS 4* series yet, and the 2* series seems very out of place for what it gives.

Also, Rinser is technically something to chase. But doing that is uhh... not so fun given the difficulty of the quest not being suited to the average player. And we might get an exchange for it eventually anyways so...

I also ended up chasing Talon Schneider for a long time, that drop eluded me and i just wanted it for a camo. Finally got it once Divide Quest update came out, from Shiva.

@Theuberclips said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

Did they? Because in CBT2, I felt the opposite. One of the best augments you could get was from Gigantix. But then again, a lot of the affixes are target farmable, so I guess in a way that's true.

I was under the impression from CBT1 (which, obviously, is now out of date) was that Augments were percentage-based increases to your weapon, making a weapon's base attack the most important stat on it. If that changed, than yeah, we're probably going to eventually go back down the road of chasing augments over weapons.

But really all they need to do is make a weapon's base attack and any standard abilities it may have on it outweight Augments, and turn Augments into supplemental increases to a weapon's power, as opposed to being the defacto thing that decides how useful a weapon is.

@Matt said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

Well, it's an issue with live service games. Very rare stuff is fine, but in games that are constantly updating with better and better stuff, nobody wants to do long farms because the gear they get will be outclassed in 2, 3, 4, 6, 12 months or whatever.

I loved the grind of PSO (and still do), but it only worked (and still works) there because the game doesn't expand. You are always working to a goal that doesn't shift the goal posts. PSO2 doesn't have this because a live service game has to make things better and better to get people to log on.

This is a very good point actually, times sure have changed haven't they. Publishers are able to push out updates as often as they want these days without any huge production/logistical issues.

@Fattest-Leg said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

@shadonic-0 said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

@Rorana said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

@Ki-Rin said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

@Rorana said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

Rare drops used to be more rare back in ep 3, honestly i much prefer the drops currently to then. It's not fun getting literal worthless vender trash for 99% of the drops

but thats what rares are now, 99% trash.

maybe to you, but i prefer being able to do stuff with the trade in currency they provide. Earlier drops were literally only useful for the meseta they provide. Also some of those drops have nice SAF to them or decent S grades. As i said before, everything in ep 3~4 (when rare drops were more rare) was basically a worthless drop.

@shadonic-0 said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

one of the things i've commented on in every survey so far is that i want the hunt for rares be worth it again. sometimes it's time intensive, sometimes you won't get what you want at all, most of the times the rare wasn't even that great to begin with, but it was always something worth hunting for and felt like you accomplished something. i hope to have that feeling back with ngs honestly. PSO2 is a pretty let down most of the time when it comes to rare weapon hunting. my current goal is the SJS.after that i'm pretty much clueless what to do next as i'm happy gear wise till NGS. all i can do is spend more time building more cras weapons for other classes.that's about it.

All i can hope for is that it doesn't return to ep 4 levels of "hunt for this". I've run a casual alliance on ship 2 since PC launch and I cannot tell you how many people in my alliance quit because they felt like trying to hunt these rares felt like a waste of what little free time they had after work. I've been told time and time again that they don't want to spend their time after work rolling the dice for a weapon or units that they most likely will never get because they can't be on to farm it all the time. Like it or not, imo pso2 is a casual MMO at the end of the day, so I think they should be catering more towards that audience.

i can understand that. but PSO2 in it's current state is still doing it wrong. players of all types have played PSO and PSU and i never heared them complain about rare hunts, mostly vent their frustration about not getting something after xxx hours spent. the problem with PSO2 is it's powercreep. instead of hunting for top tier weapons, we spend time doing time gated content to get them and instead do rare hunts for desired S-augments and augment fodder in general to build our min-max sets. that's aweful. i don't mind Zig going a bit easier on us with the material requirements and instead offer good weapons and units, but the best? that literally takes the purpose out of PSO, which has been a grinder since it's dreamcast days. the excuse "it's casual, so it should be easy" is nonesense. PSO never has been forcing you to quit your social life or work to have something to show for it. you hopped on, met up with your friends to get some rare hunts done and moved on with your life.

if we keep the powercreep up though, NGS will run into a content drought quickly.people will simply log in when there is something new to get and log off when that's done.there is no longevity in that, no pride in accomlishing something, it actually feels more like work then a game at the end of the day.

where is this gatekeeping mentality where if it's not grindy it ain't PSO coming from, not letting people that barely have some time to play craft the best gear by spending materials from the fight and gating it behind a drop is honestly such an outdated design and most of the population works long hours, just because you can stay at home 24/7 and grind all day for rares does not mean everyone can too.

well, you missed the point and ignored what i said. but it's always been this type of argument, i'm used to it.and that's coming from a service technician who gets sent around the world 2/3rd's of the year working mostly 60 hr weeks. when we used to log in to play, now we jsut log in to do our daily material farm chores so we can start over with the next content update. yes yes, future gaming is really looking great.

Problem is if you make items too rare people will quit from not getting them (Destiny 1 launch for example) or if you give too much then people quit early on due to lack of progression (Episode 3-4 with Slave/Nemesis weapons).

There has to be a middle ground and most MMO's have a hard time finding it.

@Zeke If we look at Episode 4 with some of the early weapons to really topple over the Nemesis/Raven "meta" at the time there were numerous complaints I recall seeing about how it was impossible to see a Jupiter Tullus drop. When it did show up it was extremely expensive and the same would have been seen for things like a Rappy Egg and a Rykross Staff.

The drop rates for this game in my experience never got "better" because unlike the Japanese side we were also given alternative grinds (either you run out and play the quests for hours and hours to mimic the Japanese version's month-long hunts on randomness to get the parts you rneeded for Atlas EX or you can take the new Collection Folder and repeat it a few times every few days to quickly get a similar but manageable grind). The global players never got to play this content for the same length the Japanese players to see how nasty the drop rates truly are which was largely part of why I was such a casual player on the Japanese side (I only ever got one thirteen-star New-Type weapon to drop for me and that ended up being Twin Machineguns which only allowed the Gunner, of all of my classes, to reach Level 80).

In a lot of ways I would be curious to see what kind of progression would actually work that doesn't result in overloading resources for older players (Warframe has this where some of the early resources gets pooled into the millions and nothing in the game ever costs that much so some equipment costs can be impossible for new players who haven't already played for months/years if the prices and costs were scaled up) or games that just get overly punishing where a drop might not exist unless players farmed that piece of content for months on end.

Personally to me in terms of rarity I would much rather go with the Dragon's Dogma Online approach of giving players an easy-to-see tier list of equipment ranging from "budget" gear for players who don't like grinding that give the absolute minimum amount of power to pass gear checks for participation, a "middle tier" gear set for players who do light grinding and don't feel extreme enough to run the high-end content to make their to the final tier but gives a noticeable edge compared to the budget tier, and then the "high tier" of equipment that requires the sort of "elitist" grinding and farming needed to get the equipment in the first place. In the case of Dragon's Dogma Online, you can use the game's auction shop of sorts (the Bazaar) to buy the resources and crafting materials to make the budget-tier weapons. To move onwards you needed to fight the higher-level enemies and clear dungeons that are limited by time so you are forced to make time on your schedule to go out of your way to find that content that showed up once every few days. The high-end equipment typically already required you had the previous tier in order to meet the minimum requirements (effectively the budget tier is trash for this content) and you play through content like the raids and more time-gated content (along the lines of Omega Masquerade and solo Sodam with their limited runs) in the hopes of getting the materials you needed to drop.

I feel that in Phantasy Star Online 2 there is simply no real incentive for anyone holding a Millionaire/Croesus weapon to look for an upgrade unless it was handed out like how Rivalate was and when we get to it eventually the Klauz/Agile weapons will be handed out too just like they were on the Japanese side. I have several friends who simply aren't invested in affixing or caring for their equipment but run the content because they can and are confident in being carried by the party and any attempt at me trying to explain to them what equipment they should be looking at for upgrades ends up resulting in them saying, "I'll just stick with what I got for free" because everything else is too overwhelming. Considering this game's difficulty doesn't reach anything quite like how Dragon's Dogma Online did it is saddening to me in a way that players simply can get complacent on what they are using and not seek improvement. But at the same time, I don't quite agree with how Dragon's Dogma Online always downgraded equipment in future content (the "high end" weapons I mentioned become nearly trash and are barely better than the "budget-friendly" weapons of the next content).

Unlike Phantasy Star Online 2, however, there was no free in-game alternative to simply power-leveling or skipping tiers without being carried or paying your way through the Weapon Lottery (a gacha shop where you get weapons that give you a power advantage up until a tier or two below where you are going to which the budget options are simply that much better). In that case, even having the previous high-end weapons would make the Weapon Lottery altogether a waste of money because everything you could pay for are effectively downgrades to what you grinded for already if you were very close to the current content.

I don't mind items being rare but I am more interested in seeing how Sega decides to handle having so many different series of weapons that are functionally the same and the difference is largely in numbers. I feel that the addition of S-Class Special Abilities (SSA's) helped individualize weapons but the problem suddenly went to prioritizing the weapons that have all the slots (Atlas EX, Agile, and Klauz weapons) simply for how easy they were to work with in comparison to the alternatives. I do not believe "higher rarity" should innately mean "more power" and would personally love for a way for even low-rarity equipment to still stand a chance especially in a game that is more about the player's skill rather than the equipment alone.

@VanillaLucia said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

I feel that in Phantasy Star Online 2 there is simply no real incentive for anyone holding a Millionaire/Croesus weapon to look for an upgrade unless it was handed out like how Rivalate was and when we get to it eventually the Klauz/Agile weapons will be handed out too just like they were on the Japanese side.

It does feel a little off that the options are to grind a bunch without the headstart JP got or wait for handouts to skip it entirely.

The thought occurred to me this morning that we haven't had a campaign about really progressing our gear for several months now since the old Enhance Your Weapon campaign back when 14★s were (very) rare drops, most of us had half-decently affixed Nemesis or (then) Slave weapons and the general complaint about under-geared MPA people involved them holding Deo/Nox/Sigma at +10 or +20 only.

We've had a bunch of campaigns since where low to middle tier 15★ weapons or 14-15★ weapons with SGAs pre-affixed is the reward, but none where gear progression is the task. And I'm not including the fake Episode 5 campaign series; that was just regular progression dressed up as a campaign, with no additional reward, and which was almost immediately obsoleted by handouts anyway.

But imagine like an acceleration campaign with an emote for creating (or owning a previously-created) Klauz item. Modules for Klauz units are rare drops you need a ton of, right? Maybe make them guaranteed from their sources for a while, or give 1-3 on completion of the quest they come from in addition to their potential drop until the campaign ends. That'd encourage people to do that, provide a grind reduction in line with the shorter time Global has had to get them, and feel a bit more meaningful than just dumping Klauz gear in our visiphones for doing 7 Recommended Quests on Normal.

@Miraglyth said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

Maybe make them guaranteed from their sources for a while, or give 1-3 on completion of the quest they come from in addition to their potential drop until the campaign ends. That'd encourage people to do that, provide a grind reduction in line with the shorter time Global has had to get them, and feel a bit more meaningful than just dumping Klauz gear in our visiphones for doing 7 Recommended Quests on Normal.

I REALLY wish there was some guaranteed farmable source of modules like you're suggesting. If there was something I could run that dropped at least one module per run I would be happy to farm that until I had enough to make the rest of my Klauz units. I have plenty of Shiva modules and divide medals but nothing to do with them. Why can't we spend divide medals to get like 10 of each per week? Why can't we convert one type of modules into another type? I have around 100 shiva modules right now and nothing to do with them.

At this point I have my Lightweaver weapon and Klauz back and I don't know if I will ever get the other two units because there's no guaranteed way to get modules outside of the small amount you get weekly for divide quest point rewards. I could bankrupt myself buying as many modules as I can get, but I'd spend my money on cosmetics.

@Xaelon Personally, I'm hoping they add modules to the drop pool of one of the UQs they're updating to UH. There are consistent ways to get every module (except mitra), but they all take forever given how many you actually need.

@Xaelon said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

@Miraglyth said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

Maybe make them guaranteed from their sources for a while, or give 1-3 on completion of the quest they come from in addition to their potential drop until the campaign ends. That'd encourage people to do that, provide a grind reduction in line with the shorter time Global has had to get them, and feel a bit more meaningful than just dumping Klauz gear in our visiphones for doing 7 Recommended Quests on Normal.

I REALLY wish there was some guaranteed farmable source of modules like you're suggesting. If there was something I could run that dropped at least one module per run I would be happy to farm that until I had enough to make the rest of my Klauz units. I have plenty of Shiva modules and divide medals but nothing to do with them. Why can't we spend divide medals to get like 10 of each per week? Why can't we convert one type of modules into another type? I have around 100 shiva modules right now and nothing to do with them.

At this point I have my Lightweaver weapon and Klauz back and I don't know if I will ever get the other two units because there's no guaranteed way to get modules outside of the small amount you get weekly for divide quest point rewards. I could bankrupt myself buying as many modules as I can get, but I'd spend my money on cosmetics.

You can farm Exegul/Varuna modules from people holding rooms you know.

@Miraglyth I'm not exactly so certain that the Japanese version got a headstart in their grinds as the players on that version were the first to get hit with content that effectively nullified their content (being those Atlas EX/Lightstream users who watched their weapons become the "normal" damage for the newly released Ultra Hard content at the time and the higher-end Heroes watching the class get shredded and punished on the content that came out afterwards). The global players got a much bigger headstart (alternative grind options, buffs/balance patches already applied when relevant, and as a result much of the hassle the Japanese players experienced already being stripped out).

The biggest example I can think of before Episode 6 is during Episodes 4 and 5 when the requirement to reach Level 80 involved having a New-Type thirteen star weapon relevant to the class upgraded to +35 during a time where weapons didn't guarantee dropping at +35 as a grind limit/enhance cap. You also had the other issue where you couldn't just go to the Player Shop to buy a thirteen star or fourteen star weapon because they were not yet eligible to be sold on the Player Shops at the time. The twelve star units were a no-brainer due to the Level 75 gift (Stella Wall units) but that particular grind was what pushed me into playing a Hero rather than a Gunner/Fighter because my Gunner reached Level 85 but my Fighter was stuck at 75 (due to me not playing Fighter with a botched skill tree and not getting a thirteen-star New-Type weapon at the time with a grind cap of +35). The Hero (and all other Successor classes) definitely have stop-gaps between levels that force you into completing client orders to unlock the rest of the levels but they were painless breaks in comparison to what the original classes had to deal with and even by then Sega updated the leveling mechanics so that this Level 75 class trial was removed from the original classes altogether so everyone can easily unlock the Level 75 Class Bonuses without the grind it used to have.

On top of that, players from before Episode 4 got to see their entire line of equipment become redundant or outdated when the introduction of New-Type weapons rolled out with much less grindy and more accessible upgrade options. Every weapon was guaranteed then to have a Special Ability Factor/Special Augment Factor for affixing purposes, every weapon can upgrade from +0 to +35 (assuming the grind cap allows for it), and you had absolutely very little trouble of risking failures or downgrades like you did with Old-Type weapons when the risks got higher and higher as you raised your potential's level. While very few of these Old-Type weapons still matter (such as Helen Bathina), the majority of them effectively became weapon-fashion fodder for transmutation passes and in the case of the global version most of these are non-existent outside of specific areas. I recall seeing them in the Challenge Mode but you can get one in-game (Sprue Col-C) for normal use. My point here was that global players having New-Type weapons right off the bat already trivialized and decimated most of the Episodes 1-3 content regardless of whether or not we are talking about Nemesis/Raven weapons. It was not until Episode 4 when the content we had suddenly started to put New-Type weapons on the edge when the newer fourteen star weapons and Nemesis/Raven weapons began to shine and simultaneously fade faster. When Episode 5 dropped I definitely remember there being quite a very strong crowd of proud Nemesis affixers who spent quite a bit of their resources on their godly affixes who ultimately would face the fact that Nemesis/Raven's New-Type variants were ultimately catch-up weapons on the Japanese side meant to pad the way for Atlas EX and Lightstream weapons or something that could stand up to them such as Jupiter Tullus and Rykross Staff.

I do like the gesture that Sega is willing to give players the end-game equipment as a reward as it gives access to it for players who aren't willing to or cannot play through the grind and also gives players who already have them more options for gearing up. For classes who uses multiple weapons or for the sake of gearing up multiple characters it is highly convenient when the drops needed for the Cras/Liberate/Lightstream/Atlas EX (though Atlas EX doesn't actually need it due to the Val -> Atlas upgrade requiring that) weapons are all locked behind extremely rare drops that are typically either found via titles or are near-impossible to drop in normal means. I don't quite know either if I prefer a grind that is determined on chance and randomness or if I like the idea of a guaranteed reward but you can calculate just how much time and resources you would need to get it as a result in response to stopping handout equipment and freebie end-game equipment.

@Anzio you can choose what constitutes a rare drop by choosing the number of stars so if you want only the besf of the best to be rare drops then choose the highest sfar level

@Fattest-Leg said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

You can farm Exegul/Varuna modules from people holding rooms you know.

You can farm all of them from somewhere, otherwise they'd be impossible to get! 😅 Point being as several others have just said they're a bit of a grind and cutting down on that could make for a good campaign with a bit more variety than doing 7 Recommended Quests or 12 Urgent Quests which we've had quite a bit of lately.


@Miraglyth said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

But imagine like an acceleration campaign with an emote for creating (or owning a previously-created) Klauz item. Modules for Klauz units are rare drops you need a ton of, right? [snip] That'd encourage people to do that, provide a grind reduction in line with the shorter time Global has had to get them

@VanillaLucia said in PSO2: NGS Rare Drops:

@Miraglyth I'm not exactly so certain that the Japanese version got a headstart in their grinds

JP got the Klauz unit exchange on 14 October, about two weeks after Global got Episode 5. Global didn't get the exchange until 17 February, 4 months later. Arguably the Global players who had the time between all our campaigns to keep an eye on JP power creep had a chance to farm some of the modules ahead of the exchange's addition, but even then they had considerably less time to get them overall.

That's all I meant; the literal real-world time between when the Klauz weapons and units could first be earned and present day. Whether JP had more to deal with three years prior to that during Episode 4 doesn't really have any bearing on that.