Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?

To be fair, similar happened on global before EXP Mini's got added. But yeah, grinding weapons definitely spent more, though I'd think it would kinda be evened out at this point due to a shorter time period on Global vs the longer time period on JP.

I definitely remember making a lot of money on JP just selling +20 and +30 Nox weapons. I did the same on global, too, even when +30 Revolsio's were in the Collection Folders -- at least until EXP Minis came out.

@Theuberclips said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf due to inflation or no?:

@LusterMain I do agree there's an issue with meseta sinks not existing. And yeah, this quest is still really damn good without a PSE burst. PSE Bursts just cause problems that compound onto each other: More value per trigger, more time spent running the trigger, more time spent sorting loot. All of which means you're closer to sustaining the trigger costs per week, and are spending less time farming other things that could help put other needed materials into the market such as Modules.

Consistent meseta methods are fine for sure. That's why I'm not advocating for it to be nerfed into the ground. I certainly did similar for meseta in the past.

Perhaps I should change the title to "should the loot be nerfed or not" because honestly, I think the storage issue is much worse than the inflation issue.

I only mentioned it getting nerfed into the ground because it is what they have done in the past (Elder). Though, to be fair, that case uniquely warranted it.

I do agree that this quest has put a spotlight on how bad the inventory system is in this game. I have quite a lot of empty space for it, and only keep any units that have a guardian soul component or doom break 2+, and it still takes too much time so sort through that.

To add to the discussion, I believe one of the big reasons (aside from the obvious) the quest is being run into the ground as hard as it is is that there's just not anything else going on. The only other really nearly "worth it" quests at the moment are TPD (which is barely being ran anymore and triggers still aren't readily available for it) and divide, which many global players seem to not like doing, if they can do it at all.

@HarmlessSyan said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf due to inflation or no?:

Because they removed alot of the meseta sinks for global.

The enhancement cost 0 isn't all that common on JP server, this boost week on JP was like the first time I been in that was sync'd up with enhance boost week. (and affixing is disabled since the beginning of boost week....)

There is also no weapon exp mini. On JP especially before EP6 where collection folders didn't give fodders, you had to feed your weapon slowly with 10*+5 weapons or enhancing a 12* to +26 and use it to enhance your weapon if you were short on lambda grinder. Feeding a 10 star to like a high rarity weapon is like 16k per weapon? and still like 10k to 12*.

I was talking mainly about global, but I am vaguely aware of the state of jp. It's true that global has had it much "easier", but it does not necessarily detract from the point that the meseta sinks are insufficient (I was also only mentioning the 2 sinks which I believed to be the most significant. I am well aware there are others like weapon grinding, because I was unfortunate enough to live through them briefly). They clearly haven't done a sufficient job of reigning in inflation on jp, from what I've seen.

I totally forgot to add one last thing to the topic.

Some really rare S-Grade Augments drop in Cradle as capsules (S7: Rainbow Adept comes to mind), and trying to loot them during a PSE burst is frightening. There's a cap to the amount of loot that can be on the ground at the same time which can erase drops based on age... so you're frantically trying to deposit or trash loot, but every time something gets autolooted, your menu navigation or selection gets cancelled even if it's an item that just automatically got sent to storage. (I personally tested the loot cap stuff in the VHAQ days, and it was very noticable with ARKS Fever or Mesetan drops disappearing after a long PSE burst without looting)

So honestly, removing PSE bursts would just make the quest less stressful too. I really just see it as a win-win at this point. Reward is still there but not as extreme as before, quest is less stressful, and people that don't have as much storage don't have an awful time running it.

@Miraglyth said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@Jamesmor said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf due to inflation or no?:

the prices will be inflated regardless having those UQ or not

How so? If the money supply doesn't increase, where does the extra money come from?

the supply of money doesn't need to increase to the prices be inflated, those who are selling stuff will inflate their prices if they know people will want it more so when the cosmetics of the new graphic engine will come the prices will skyrocket even more, what we are seeing now is just a small taste of what will come.

@Theuberclips said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

I totally forgot to add one last thing to the topic.

Some really rare S-Grade Augments drop in Cradle as capsules (S7: Rainbow Adept comes to mind), and trying to loot them during a PSE burst is frightening. There's a cap to the amount of loot that can be on the ground at the same time which can erase drops based on age... so you're frantically trying to deposit or trash loot, but every time something gets autolooted, your menu navigation or selection gets cancelled even if it's an item that just automatically got sent to storage. (I personally tested the loot cap stuff in the VHAQ days, and it was very noticable with ARKS Fever or Mesetan drops disappearing after a long PSE burst without looting)

So honestly, removing PSE bursts would just make the quest less stressful too. I really just see it as a win-win at this point. Reward is still there but not as extreme as before, quest is less stressful, and people that don't have as much storage don't have an awful time running it.

I think a better solution for that issue in particular would be to make items like SSA/SGA capsules be available for auto-pickup. You can still miss them if they're on the ground, mostly because they don't look much different from mystery weapon drops.

@Jamesmor said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

the supply of money doesn't need to increase to the prices be inflated, those who are selling stuff will inflate their prices if they know people will want it more

That's just not how economics works lol. Give everyone 100m and a rare item will be priced at more than 100m because buyers have that money. If everyone who'd want to buy something only has 5m, it would not be priced that high because there'd be no possible buyers.

@Miraglyth said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@Jamesmor said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

the supply of money doesn't need to increase to the prices be inflated, those who are selling stuff will inflate their prices if they know people will want it more

That's just not how economics works lol. Give everyone 100m and a rare item will be priced at more than 100m because buyers have that money. If everyone who'd want to buy something only has 5m, it would not be priced that high because there'd be no possible buyers.

Jamesmor is correct, but using the wrong wording. They are essentially saying that prices are going to go up for many cosmetics because demand is going to have a sudden explosion, but have gotten this partly confused with inflation. That, or I'm interpreting it very wrong.

@LusterMain said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

They are essentially saying that prices are going to go up for many cosmetics because demand is going to have a sudden explosion

Oh in that case yeah, all the new and returning players we hope NGS to lead to would be a natural demand increase on a similar scale to how pre-PC cosmetics often exploded in price after PC launch.

A few other factors play into that, such as the differences in the NGS player shops (including what's presently planned to be a flat 10% tax with ongoing tweaks; I really wish they'll make tax a sliding scale to increase as selling price rises), the potential inability to transfer items to sell in NGS, the potential reappearance of some of the items being sold in permanent or revival scratches and so on.

But the existence of this phenomenon doesn't mean that pumping vast amounts of meseta into active Oracle circulation isn't also detrimental to stability, both before and after NGS launches.

UH Craddle is a good, consistent and much needed steady source of meseta. Prices will be unusually high for a while but the economy will stabilize eventually. The people who can keep up grinding billions of meseta through Craddle on a weekly basis are a very, very small minority. UH Craddle should stay as it is.

I actually haven’t had a chance to try it yet due to schedule but most UQ of the past have given me a good chunk of meseta too, especially repeat ones.

But I fear the consequences if this particular UQ gives far more. The players buying gear might be fine but cosmetics might be in trouble.

There could be a drop in AC buyers if they can just easily get fat stacks of meseta for having fun in an UQ. This will reduce how many cosmetics will be on the market so the market will have to bend to the much higher prices, there could potentially even be a shortage. Sure this probably won’t stop the mega whales but it could reduce the more casual spenders who likely make up a bigger percentage of AC buyers.

I don't think the UQ should get a loot nerf but the triggers should be removed from the shops as the "24/7 trigger trains" seem to be the main offender here.

@Ryoga Cradle Triggers can't actually be sold on player shops fyi. They're available only through the alliance shop and cannot be traded. People probably finished the important buffs on their tree and then started stockpiling triggers because there's nothing else good to buy with AP.

My two main issues are inventory/storage space and the possibility of missing capsules. I've never bought space for either inventory or storage and have managed to get by with the fact that I always have premium storage. But my first run of drawn to darkness tanked my space entirely. I really don't like feeling pushed to buy space. I praised PSO2 for having fantastic F2P setups but this pushes against that.

Also the fact that you can ever miss capsule drops because auto loot doesn't nab them is frankly disgusting.

@Knight-Raime The Auto-loot system in general needs a ton of work. I really wish it gave us way more control over what to auto-loot. I turned off auto-loot for weapons for this quest when I had my storage filled completely after one long chain of PSE bursts.

Like why is there no option to only loot 14* weapons or above? It would be even better if we could tell the game to only loot un-ID'd weapons or equipment with X number of slots or more.

This quest makes me wish PSO2 had programmable loot filters like PoE.

Think the damage been done already. People just going to have to brace for the inflation.

These drops are the only reason people are OK running these old ass Urgents - if you remove the drops, it make these "new" content completely worthless to run. Wonder what are the drops for UH versions of Apprentice Mining Base and Omega Apprentice UQs, it's just recycling old content and throwing goodies so people would run them and let them feel like the content development isn't completely dead. Cheap trick but you see all these people spamming cradle, it's working.