Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?

The loot and exp from cradle is really good though. I got several of my classes to 100 by farming cradle for both. I don't think what he said should be dismissed that easily.... RQ4 is just painfully slow for me sorry and the bonus keys you get from alts are not very much to boost as much as cradle's nonstop triggers are. You get like 1 level per day on alts? Then 3 gold keys per week while a few hours in cradle can just boost you up without the wait. RQ4 has the disadvantage of horrible maps on rotation and people ditching once they get their gift(and going to a cradle trigger). In all honesty, Cradle replaced everything level 85 and above for me. This is just my experience.

@hee-ho

Yeah, this. Cradle gives quite a lot more EXP than other "good" EXP quests even without any extra boosts over the others in addition to all the rewards it's already notorious for giving. And that's assuming the other "good" EXP quests are always readily available like cradle trigs are. Other quests struggle to even compete.

@Milk said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@Miraglyth said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

In fairness NGS hasn't launched yet, so perhaps the new-physique outfits and emotes are only available in PSO2 because they can't distribute them in NGS yet. I'm hopeful they'll make future NGS scratch items and other cosmetics unable to be sent back to PSO2 because heck knows their refusal to reduce Cradle's obscene drops has just ruined the meseta economy.

I hope so too. I just sold an emote for 200m, never in the six months I’ve been playing has an emote sold that high, not even fan favorite poledance or vocal performance. Granted not everything has skyrocketed but those hot ticket items absolutely have and anyone not able to keep up with Cradle is going to have to whale or miss out. Players will just leave if their goals aren’t obtainable anymore, I feel really bad for newbies walking into this mess and seeing 100m hair, ridiculous.

I have unfortunately felt this issue and have flat out stopped spending money on this version of the game since I rather spend it in JP also pretty much stopped playing it actively since I refocused my efforts into JP but I will log in once in every while.

Not until I get my J-Sword!

@LusterMain said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

in addition to all the rewards it's already notorious for giving. And that's assuming the other "good" EXP quests are always readily available like cradle trigs are.

This touches on the two points I was describing though. I'll glaze over the benefit of more people running it, because I'd already made the point that if any other quest was the most lucrative people would be running (and getting PSE Bursts in) that and the EXP benefit would be there instead.

But the other point is - as you say - you run Cradle for the loot. You're there for an obscene amount of 13★ and 14★ weapons, high-slot units and the potential for one or two good SGA adds. Since the experience gain happens on top of that, it doesn't feel as much like you're working for it as running keys does which makes it feel faster. It's a relative thing.

I had the same when Episode 6 simultaneously raised the level cap to 95 and dropped the Christmas on Ice UQ. I farmed the heck out of that UQ for my Serpent Prenzer, and it felt like hitting level 95 on multiple classes (including newly-released Phantom) took no time at all! Objectively it took quite a while especially since there was no constant +300% boost campaign to support it, but the perception was very different to the reality.

@YagyuChan said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@Milk said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@Miraglyth said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

In fairness NGS hasn't launched yet, so perhaps the new-physique outfits and emotes are only available in PSO2 because they can't distribute them in NGS yet. I'm hopeful they'll make future NGS scratch items and other cosmetics unable to be sent back to PSO2 because heck knows their refusal to reduce Cradle's obscene drops has just ruined the meseta economy.

I hope so too. I just sold an emote for 200m, never in the six months I’ve been playing has an emote sold that high, not even fan favorite poledance or vocal performance. Granted not everything has skyrocketed but those hot ticket items absolutely have and anyone not able to keep up with Cradle is going to have to whale or miss out. Players will just leave if their goals aren’t obtainable anymore, I feel really bad for newbies walking into this mess and seeing 100m hair, ridiculous.

I have unfortunately felt this issue and have flat out stopped spending money on this version of the game since I rather spend it in JP also pretty much stopped playing it actively since I refocused my efforts into JP but I will log in once in every while.

I honestly can’t blame you. If NGS doesn’t meet expectations then I might just be done with the company. I’m really disappointed with the (expected) outcome of PSO2’s economy. Games need constant monitoring to prevent inflation like this, the fact that they’ve just treated the market lately like a lawless free for all doesn’t sit right with me. You never want wealth tied to one method and give too much power to the advantaged(like big alliances) because they control the market. That should be the company’s job, not the players like this. We can’t go with a good faith system, the economy has been freaking destroyed from a good faith system.

It’s probably too late to fix this nightmare they created and I don’t have much hope for NGS either because it’s going to be the same people running it but one can hope they learn from PSO2.

@Milk said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

I don’t have much hope for NGS either because it’s going to be the same people running it but one can hope they learn from PSO2.

In fairness it's also the same people that ran PSO2 for going on 9 years in Japan without such issues. Inflation at the last minute that hopefully has no way to be connected to New Genesis (because little would kill an influx of new players faster than the discovery that even content new to NGS is massively beyond reasonable access) could still be the exception here.

@Miraglyth said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@Milk said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

I don’t have much hope for NGS either because it’s going to be the same people running it but one can hope they learn from PSO2.

In fairness it's also the same people that ran PSO2 for going on 9 years in Japan without such issues. Inflation at the last minute that hopefully has no way to be connected to New Genesis (because little would kill an influx of new players faster than the discovery that even content new to NGS is massively beyond reasonable access) could still be the exception here.

You’re right, things were running smoothly, some MMOs don’t even reach nine years so that should be applauded. I really hope this frankly thoughtless decision is a one-off because as I’ve said before in numerous topics, broken economies kill games…It would be such a shame to see a game I’ve grown so fond of to go out like this, over one stupid mistake that went on so long that it couldn’t be fixed.

It’s just a “wait and see” kind of moment.

To avoid the flood of items on player storages, if it was me, I would change most of the 13s and 14s into plainly Excube already exchanged. It is already done in the latest UQs, so just do so. But then SEGA would stop giving us more reasons to try to sell us storage.

The "marketplace" has always been a black hole for meseta, so that can't be helped. If loot was nerfed, people would justify the current prices as "it is similar to JP trends", "it is a limited item and won't show anymore this late into PSO2's life cycle", or other "reasons" like those.

@Miraglyth said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@LusterMain said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

in addition to all the rewards it's already notorious for giving. And that's assuming the other "good" EXP quests are always readily available like cradle trigs are.

This touches on the two points I was describing though. I'll glaze over the benefit of more people running it, because I'd already made the point that if any other quest was the most lucrative people would be running (and getting PSE Bursts in) that and the EXP benefit would be there instead.

But the other point is - as you say - you run Cradle for the loot. You're there for an obscene amount of 13★ and 14★ weapons, high-slot units and the potential for one or two good SGA adds. Since the experience gain happens on top of that, it doesn't feel as much like you're working for it as running keys does which makes it feel faster. It's a relative thing.

I had the same when Episode 6 simultaneously raised the level cap to 95 and dropped the Christmas on Ice UQ. I farmed the heck out of that UQ for my Serpent Prenzer, and it felt like hitting level 95 on multiple classes (including newly-released Phantom) took no time at all! Objectively it took quite a while especially since there was no constant +300% boost campaign to support it, but the perception was very different to the reality.

Mira, please actually read and respond to the entire post I made instead of cherry picking specific sentences that support your view. Cradle has no magic EXP boost just because more people are running it, it already gives a colossal amount of EXP not because I'm delusional but because I actually looked at how much EXP I was getting. (you can get just around an entire level over level 85 with no PSE in a single run when using proper exp boosts (no, I don't care that it has 300% exp right now, because other quests do as well and others with higher still aren't as good)) without needing any extra EXP boost higher than others get. That it's the single quest in the game that is the most worth running for almost every other reason is a bonus.

You also completely misunderstand what availability means. It's true that half of it is if people are playing it or not, but you completely failed to address the actual point I made which was that other "good EXP quests" are literally not always available. This is particularly apparent when every single example of a quest other than cradle that's good for EXP you gave earlier in this topic are all very time-limited in some way (RQ4 only has good quests on at best 3/5 days (and only 1 of those 5 is actually fast enough to maybe not go insane), Lament (uq, you don't want people running around levelling 85 in here), Swirling Inferno (uq), Abyss (which only just a week ago got its trigger, and you don't want people running around levelling 85 in here. If you have actually played any TPD pug for the past 2 weeks you will understand why)).

Also, please stop bringing up keys. Keys are the worst example of extremely limited EXP gain. Everyone already knows they're by far the best EXP quests, and anyone who is actually trying to level does not have any because you are given so few of them, so telling people "keys are way better!" does not make any point whatsoever.

(Disclaimer and openness: This post was heavily edited to reduce hysteria on my part. I wasn't asked or told to; I just didn't like how it came over.)


@LusterMain said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

Mira, please actually read and respond to the entire post I made instead of cherry picking specific sentences that support your view. [snip] Also, please stop bringing up keys. [snip] telling people "keys are way better!" does not make any point whatsoever.

It wasn't trying to make the point you claim; my only mention of keys in the post you quoted said nothing about the amount of EXP they gave, only the feeling of time spend getting it.

I picked up on that line because it was the only line that related to the phenomenon I was describing. To lump the entire rest of your post into the quote - just to avoid "cherry picking" - would waste space and obfuscate that context.

If you'd prefer a separate comparison: Imagine boiling a kettle. If you put it on and walk away to have a conversation with friends or family you're making hot drinks for, it'll feel like it boils in no time compared to simply waiting for it to boil. But it'll boil no faster. If that point of relativity doesn't interest you then feel free to ignore it, but please don't tell me I "completely misunderstand" things that are unrelated to that.


@LusterMain said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

you completely failed to address the actual point I made which was that other "good EXP quests" are literally not always available.

Since JC brought up the subject of EXP You made one post prior to the one you've just replied to:

@LusterMain said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

Cradle gives quite a lot more EXP than other "good" EXP quests even without any extra boosts over the others in addition to all the rewards it's already notorious for giving. And that's assuming the other "good" EXP quests are always readily available like cradle trigs are. Other quests struggle to even compete.

"And that's assuming the other "good" EXP quests are always readily available"

That's not making a point of comparative availability, it's dismissing it. Your post specifically claims that Cradle would be better than the others even if they were always available. Again, it's not saying Cradle is better because it's more available, but that it would continue to be better even if it wasn't!

That's the opposite of what you are now saying you said; I did "actually read" and address "the actual point". It just doesn't seem to have been the point you thought you were making?

Now if you want to discuss that, I'd be happy to. At this point I might have over-levelled Summoner on Swirling Inferno enough times to have taken a class from 1 to 100, and I've a few things to say about the alleged always-availability of Cradle if you're not in a huge co-ordinated tryhard alliance too. But despite your claims that's a conversation we just weren't having before.

And regardless it's a conversation that has no bearing on the topic of Cradle's loot (not its EXP) having just slaughtered the value of meseta. If you think tanking the economy (through financially luring the bulk of players into running one quest) is a justified consequence of (allegedly) helping people get classes to level 100 then that's a debate subject I think has mileage and one which may be a better fit for this topic.

@Miraglyth why do you live on these forums? All day and night, the times you'll be posting on here makes it seem like you get 4 hours of sleep and leave this website open on your phone or pc all day every day checking religiously. It's okay to not be top tog on a forum for a video game of all things, or to just be in the wrong here and there. Your points aren't any more valid than another's and I personally side more with the person you're currently arguing against for little to no reason. The value people find in the exp the trigger gives does in fact relate to it's drops, because it's part of why it's being run by many and those very same people get the money as a "bonus" even if they didn't care to. Please just stop

@Phill-N-Kills said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@Miraglyth why do you live on these forums? All day and night, the times you'll be posting on here makes it seem like you get 4 hours of sleep and leave this website open on your phone or pc all day every day checking religiously. It's okay to not be top tog on a forum for a video game of all things, or to just be in the wrong here and there. Your points aren't any more valid than another's and I personally side more with the person you're currently arguing against for little to no reason. The value people find in the exp the trigger gives does in fact relate to it's drops, because it's part of why it's being run by many and those very same people get the money as a "bonus" even if they didn't care to. Please just stop

I like reading his thoughts! I also like his reasons for posting weather I agree or disagree.

@Phill-N-Kills said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

Your points aren't any more valid than another's

I wouldn't claim them to be. I was just being told I wasn't paying attention to a conversation that in fact didn't exist. Should I not be allowed to point that out? 🤔

@Phill-N-Kills said in Cradle of Darkness Ultra Hard: Nerf the loot or no?:

@Miraglyth why do you live on these forums? All day and night, the times you'll be posting on here makes it seem like you get 4 hours of sleep and leave this website open on your phone or pc all day every day checking religiously. It's okay to not be top tog on a forum for a video game of all things, or to just be in the wrong here and there. Your points aren't any more valid than another's and I personally side more with the person you're currently arguing against for little to no reason. The value people find in the exp the trigger gives does in fact relate to it's drops, because it's part of why it's being run by many and those very same people get the money as a "bonus" even if they didn't care to. Please just stop

Don't engage in conversations if you want them to stop then.