NGS charging tax in advance on player shop sales?

Latest news says "Upon putting an item up for sale in the PSO2:NGS Personal Shop, the seller will pay 10% of the selling price"

Does this really mean you have to pay in advance, rather than tax being a cut of your sale earnings?

Until shown otherwise, then yes.

It's probably meant to prevent people from hiking up prices too much, since rather than just putting items up for ridiculous prices at the start and then slowly undercutting eachother until it sells, you have to decide the point where you think the price will actually settle if you don't wanna lose a decent chunk of change in the undercut process. WoW had/has (idk if it's changed since Warlords time) a similar pre-tax on their auction house stuff, too.

Can see pros/cons to it, I feel like it might make selling feel a bit more stifling but we'll see.

I’m more confused about this AC “recommended” item thing. Are they controlling the price for hot ticket items? I don’t fully understand the wording for it.

@Milk It sounds like it'll be exactly that for the more premium items that people are buying up a lot more

Bad translation.

On the beta, the tax was deducted on SELLING the item. The JP announcement backs this.

Basically the way it works now is: If you price an item for 100m, you get 90m on selling it. You're placing the price now instead of placing how much you're going to get and the game adding the tax on.

We'll have to see, but based off what JP website says, it seems like this is just a bad translation on global side. Which to be fair, it's kinda hard to put the above into words without an example.

Yeah looks to be bad translation, reddit is talking about it too

https://www.reddit.com/r/PSO2/comments/lr1v6e/pso2ngs_about_the_personal_shop/

As Theuberclips said. The tax is collected at the time of transaction, not when the item is put on sale.

The way how NGS tax works was announced back when the first CBT started (announcement) and this had been confirmed through the beta test.

The Japanese text on this point put emphasis on who pays the tax. In NGS, it is the seller (and not the buyer) who pays the sales tax.

『PSO2:NGS』のマイショップでは、出品された方が手数料(落札価格の10%)を支払う仕様となります。

To illustrate this, let us think about the minimum 1,000 Meseta sale. In PSO2, the buyer pays 1,050 and the seller gets 1,000. In NGS, the buyer pays 1,000 N-Meseta and the seller gets 900 N-Meseta.

So the original Japanese text talks about the difference of excluded tax and included tax, they actually didn't say anything about when the tax is collected (the actual timing was confirmed in the beta test). English translation adding the phrase of "Upon putting an item up for sale" is somehow misleading, indeed.

Upon putting an item up for sale in the PSO2:NGS Personal Shop, the seller will pay 10% of the selling price as a commission fee.

@Theuberclips said in NGS charging tax in advance on player shop sales?:

We'll have to see, but based off what JP website says, it seems like this is just a bad translation on global side.

Beat me to it yeah. The issue is the Global site text says "Upon putting an item up for sale [snip] the seller will pay". It directly says the payment happens at the time of listing.


@Fiona-Respha said in NGS charging tax in advance on player shop sales?:

The Japanese text on this point put emphasis on who pays the tax. In NGS, it is the seller (and not the buyer) who pays the sales tax.

It's kind of an in-between as to who pays. In PSO2 the seller always controls both the amount they receive and the amount a buyer pays, and that isn't changing in NGS.

The only thing that's changing is which of the two amounts is used to set the price. If NGS had left the tax at a flat 5%, sellers in NGS could just set a buyer-pays price of 1,050 and it'd operate exactly the same as if they'd set a seller-receives price of 1,000 now.

If they'd wanted maximum convenience they could have made input fields for both values with any changes to one instantly updating the other. But I guess they're trying to reduce confusion, and if only one is available it probably makes a little more sense to make the settable one be the buyer-pays price since that makes price-matching or undercutting a little more simple.

@Milk said in NGS charging tax in advance on player shop sales?:

I’m more confused about this AC “recommended” item thing. Are they controlling the price for hot ticket items? I don’t fully understand the wording for it.

We already have that "recommended" thing in PSO2, shown by a green pointing finger icon on the prize list of various scratches. According to JP NGS Swiki, it looks like they set minimum listing price of 100,000 for recommended AC scratch items on personal shops in CBT1, where regular items had minimum price of 1,000.

I'm not very sure why they put this restriction. Maybe they are trying to regulate the price of AC scratch items?


@Miraglyth Indeed who is going to pay the sales tax is not a very important issue for players. That's the reason I had to use the minimum price case to illustrate the difference.

But probably it is a big issue for those who actually develop the system, and that was the point of the JP announcement. I feel the dev sometimes fails to stand on the viewpoint of players, as the raise of the sales tax to 10% is much more a huge issue for us in this case.

Off-topic, the fact that Japan's general consumption tax rate was 5% in the year of 2012 (when personal shop started) and now 10% is rather hilarious 😒

I think it's safe to say the announcement is not a good one. The tax is ridiculous and will hurt friends who want to help each other by transferring wealth through the shop. Price controls in a game are just dumb, price controls only make sense in the real world, where ironically they are never used. All of this makes the game less friendly for friends who play together. With these changes, Sega would be insane and unethical to charge the same as they do now for Premium, because Premium has been made less valuable by all of this. I'll not be playing NGS, just seems bad. I'm thinking the era of the MMORPG is coming to an end soon if games don't stop with the nonsense.

What's next, putting useful items in scratch to effectively turn them into loot boxes that make the game pay to win?

The no trading part alone is going to make it harder to help friends but we’ll just have to wait and see.

Would be better if it were a % fee to list it imo, unfortunate that it was apparently just a mistranslation.

I’m not a fan of the upfront % because if sellers are trying to make n-meseta then maybe they can’t even list the item, too broke. Oh how I hated that system in other games. One took a % at listing then another at successful sale and another if you modified an existing price. It was to combat a broken economy but our economy was still broken, and infact more broken because sellers stopped buying cash shop stuff because the market nickeled and dimed them, then we just had less stuff to buy in general and a bidding war when one did come up for sale, it was a real mess.

I’m cautiously optimistic here. I don’t like the new changes because I’ve seen said changes harm an economy rather than help it, but maybe with the right monitoring things will be alright.

One thing to keep in mind is that Global can also be different than Japan. If this is the case, it may not have have a mis-translation at all. Hlobal PSO2 already has plenty of differences with Japan, too.