monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations)

@Milk if i spend star gems that i got for free on a costume that becomes outdated months later i regret it lol, no way am i putting a single cent into this money trap. your opinion doesnt matter because apperently you have that much money to blow away like its nothing. "ill just re-buy it a few months later with added hand animations and a new procedurally generated texture finish, so who cares?"

your argument basically boils down to "im willing to dump over a grand in this game so why are other people upset?"

there are a million better things you can do with that money :'D

Edit : oops repeat comment! How did I not catch that?

@ENERSHA420 said in monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

@Milk if i spend star gems that i got for free on a costume that becomes outdated months later i regret it lol, no way am i putting a single cent into this money trap. your opinion doesnt matter because apperently you have that much money to blow away like its nothing. "ill just re-buy it a few months later with added hand animations and a new procedurally generated texture finish, so who cares?"

your argument basically boils down to "im willing to dump over a grand in this game so why are other people upset?"

there are a million better things you can do with that money :'D

Except I told you that even if I can afford it, I choose not to. Buyers Remorse is your own problem, not the company’s. I don’t pay for SG scratch because I wouldn’t be happy about spending money and getting garbage, it’s the same thing. Every item we buy is a choice. You can choose to buy the old outfit now and be happy with it or you can wait until a possible updated version later, you don’t get to have both. You know people can still have the value of a dollar at every income bracket, right? If I don’t feel something is a good value then I simply don’t buy it. You act like I’m stupid or beneath you for finding joy and value in spending money on this game.

My point in bringing it up was people from all walks of life play this game, you pay little and I pay more, some players pay even more than that. As a collector of outfits I think I’d have a fair bit of knowledge on the subject and I told you regardless of what I paid I don’t feel I or anyone else is entitled to free labor in an already free videogame. If this game had a sub then I would maybe see where you’re coming from.

Nice edit. You really like lording over people, don’t you?

I regularly give to charity and deliver toys to children. I support animal shelters and donate to people in need on Reddit or Gofundme. What, pray tell, do you feel I should be doing with my money? My gosh, you would probably have a heart attack over what I spend on gasp hobbies. It’s almost like entertainment costs money.

We’re done here, you’re just taking your anger out on me because you couldn’t win your original argument with Miraglyth. That’s not my problem. Continue screaming into the void then if my opinion doesn’t matter.

@Milk right so you have enough money to donate. that basically puts you in the extremely small minority of people with expendable funds. your concept of money is completely separated from the general public. but continue to tell me about how im lording over you haha

@ENERSHA420 would you be more satisfied if NGS was a separate game rather than tied to PSO2?

It has it's own combat system different from PSO2, character progression, gear progression - hardly just a texture update or game expansion.

@HarmlessSyan yes, because if it were a standalone game every model would have hand animations and uniform outfit graphics regardless if other players choose to equip the new body type version or not (because all costumes would be new body type versions). this is called 2021 industry standard

@Milk for us peasants here on planet earth, this business model is outrageous. the reason you arent seeing more outrage is because not enough people even care about this game. if League of Legends forced players to re-grind for their main everytime it was reworked a lot more people would be pissed

@ENERSHA420 said in monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

no way am i putting a single cent into this money trap. your opinion doesnt matter

These two statements in succession are somewhat hilarious. You've literally declared that no matter what they do, even if you get what you want you won't support this game. I'm not sure that's a particularly compelling argument to pass on to Sega, you know?

"This person wants you to give them a set of newly-made AC scratch outfits for free because they're not even willing to spend meseta on it. Their gratitude for listening would never lead them to spending money, but maybe consider the request anyway?"


@ENERSHA420 said in monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

if it were a standalone game every model would have hand animations and uniform outfit graphics

If it were a standalone new game you'd get the NGS default outfit options for free and would have to AC scratch for everything else including any new outfits that reference ones from PSO2, the previous game with no content overlap. See, you missed out the part where a new standalone game means starting from square one.

So hey wait a second... that's exactly what we're getting, only with the content overlap which importantly includes legacy accessories being usable with NGS fashion. We're literally getting better than if it were a new standalone game, and you're complaining that the deal isn't even sweeter.


@ENERSHA420 said in monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

@Milk for us peasants here on planet earth, this business model is outrageous.

You are literally asking for a business model where they do what you want and you don't pay them anyway. And that's not outrageous?

@Miraglyth

I can’t even wrap my head around this anymore, I even personally looked for a comparable game that performed the miracle this person is asking for and it flat out has never been done, any games I did find either charged money for it, had a significantly less workload or both. Finding out they want all of this for free for an outfit they never even paid for is the icing on the cake.

@Milk the difference is the graphics are upgraded accross the board. you wouldnt see any models from the previous title. the way it exists currently they have the worst of both worlds. they are nickle and diming minor graphical upgrades while half the models on my screen are not updated. even if i paid for the model theres no guarantee that someone else with the same model will be upgraded.

having 2 characters standing side by side in game with the same outfit with one having finger animations and slightly higher rez is just a silly way to implement a graphic update. this simply doesnt meet the industry standard

like what if they upgrade the hair physics for each hairstyle? should we re buy each individual hair style? where is the line? it simply cant be advertised as an engine upgrade under these conditions if half the characters look like they are from the previous title

i cant even find what engine they are using so either they didnt upgrade the engine or they made their own in house which is not a recommended industry practice. this would result in upgrading the models being more work than it should because the developers also have to create their own dev tools from scratch (a very common practice of traditionally run Japanese companies)

this is why games like Tomb Raider and Final Fantasy 15 can sell a lot and generate a lot of income but fail to make any profit due to severely bloated development procedures and outdated business practices

my point is this: if Sega has an idiotic management and it costs them extra to upgrade the models thats not my bloody problem and if it doesnt then dont charge me for it

amazon has a lot of these problems too apparently yikes. also reminds me how sega forces their broken launcher on us. just replace amazon with sega and you get the picture https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2LHemmWGsI

I don't think it should be free and I agree with Akonyl. Not going to ask Dev team to do volunteer work.

Also I want to stress that Milks and everyone's opinions do count. Ignore anyone that says otherwise.

What in the Karen did I just read? You want new models for free? Look, the only way that would work is if SEGA introduced a flagging system, that would auto detect if a player had the PSO2 original outfit/layering wear, that's account bound, and auto unlock that item for said players. That way they wouldn't lose too much cash flow, that said, the company has to pay it's employees, this is a live service, and without growth in revenue, shareholders pull out, and CEO's are left carrying the bags. So that's why they haven't setup such a system.

You can just do what those waiting for NGS did, and play the market, and use meseta to buy the cosmetics, that a player who played the scratch didn't want. Weekly challenges were worth 100,000 meseta in the closed beta in Japan, so it's likely we will see the same type of currency flow in game on our end. But complaining about having to buy new remakes of old models, is as immature as a person complaining about having to buy a remaster of an old classic game for thirty dollars. People have to get paid for the work they do, otherwise it's indentured servitude, or slavery. Those that work on our games have bills to pay, and mouths to feed, and nothing in this world is every truly free, someone is taking a loss somewhere when you get anything that's called free.

Free to play models require consistency in cash flow, brought about by cosmetics sales, premium services, or other such services, and keeping servers live also costs money in and of itself, so that's another cost to account for right there. Nobody rides for free. If this was a pay to play, at a flat rate of sixty dollars, and expansion on story had cost money as well, then I could say you have a valid argument about the cost of cosmetics here, but as that isn't the case with PSO2, you simply dont have an argument, or a leg to stand on.

@Ranmaru I don't think you folks have any idea how companies operate. the devs are paid up front. NGS is fully funded up front. you need to invest the money before development even starts. charging for individual models after the fact is just Sega trying to cheese money out of the playerbase which will expand or decline based on how user friendly the game and business model is or isn't (see archage)

@Milk

You should know by now the dude is a troll. Don't feed it.

@ENERSHA420 said in 1monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

the difference is the graphics are upgraded accross the board. you wouldnt see any models from the previous title

Ripping up your own claim that "no one is suggesting all the old costumes be released all at once". Because if you're asking for none of the several thousands of PSO2 wearable pieces to be seen, you either want them to be released all at once or for there to be a period where people who own those pieces to be told "sorry, this isn't working in NGS yet so you can't use it for now!". Honestly that'd be a horrible thing for them to do, and it appals me that you'd want this.


@ENERSHA420 said in monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

having 2 characters standing side by side in game with the same outfit with one having finger animations and slightly higher rez is just a silly way to implement a graphic update.

What's funny here is you've spent most of this topic trying to describe the new version as a minor upgrade including twisting that gif to make it seem like they're the same. So by your own claims, having PSO2 and NGS physiques side by side shouldn't look out of place at all. Nice job with the hypocrisy again.


@ENERSHA420 said in monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

i cant even find what engine they are using so either they didnt upgrade the engine or they made their own in house which is not a recommended industry practice. this would result in upgrading the models being more work than it should

The implication here is that an out-of-the-box engine magically contains a magic "create new polygons, maps, bones and textures" button. They don't. That work would still be an unfeasible amount of manual work no matter which engine is used, and trying to pretend otherwise is downright silly.


@ENERSHA420 said in monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

my point is this: if Sega has an idiotic management

That's not a point, it's you whinging based on a childish complaint that you "paid" for your 1,500 meseta outfit that's free in character creation, want a new outfit that looks like it for free and aren't getting it.


@ENERSHA420 said in monetizing costume textures (and model rigging and finger animations):

I don't think you folks have any idea how companies operate. the devs are paid up front. NGS is fully funded up front.

Do you have a copy of its budget? Because I imagine "Recreate thousands of clothing and robot pieces that were the bulk of the game's business model for 9 years and give them away for free" were not part of that and therefore were not paid for up front.

Saying "it's paid for up front" means nothing when you don't know what "it" is. You have a fantasy that something unnecessary was included, but the fantasies of ENERSHA420 probably weren't considered by the NGS planning team.